Page 3 of 9 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 90

Thread: Top 15 (Steelers Big Board)

          
   
   
    Bookmark and Share
  1. #21
    Assistant Coach steelchamp204's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    4,106
    Quote Originally Posted by Black@Gold Forever32 View Post
    I like Ebron but I don't think he is on the level of a Graham, Gronk, Davis....But not many TE's are.....The fact Ebron doesn't offer anything when it comes to blocking will be the reason he won't be a Steeler......The Steelers expect their TE's to be factors in the running game.....I wish they would change from that and add an elite play-making TE but that is their way.
    I really like CJ Fierdowicz out of Iowa. Great run blocking TE and a huge target in the redzone.

  2. #22
    SA's #1 Pirates Fan Tetris Champion Black@Gold Forever32's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Michigan City, IN
    Posts
    12,977
    My Mood
    Mad
    Quote Originally Posted by steelchamp204 View Post
    I really like CJ Fierdowicz out of Iowa. Great run blocking TE and a huge target in the redzone.
    Yea he is the type of TE the Steelers look for.

  3. #23
    K Train's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    In hell
    Posts
    18,413
    In all seriousness I'd probably prefer ASJ or Niklas in 2 than Ebron in 1. But to me ebron is significantly safer if a pick that Benjamin and provides similar ability, but less upside.

  4. #24
    Assistant Coach
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Posts
    4,699
    Quote Originally Posted by TarlsQtr View Post
    It would be foolish not to. Anyone who completely ignores what other knowledgeable people say on a topic is living in a very narrow world and has a far too high opinion of his own abilities.

    I mean, really?

    You are a very smart guy but this is RDS/Crash territory for you. Please step back.

    The guy has evaluated thousands of college players pre-draft. That you found one where you are right and he is wrong is completely unremarkable. Heck, if you could get access to the pre-draft notes of a legendary talent evaluator like Bill Walsh, you could pick who you believe is the dumbest poster here and he probably has 50 examples of him being right and Walsh wrong. Think about it. You (and I) have spent a lot of time here defending Colbert/Tomlin for their drafts against those who think they suck evaluating talent and Mayock's opinion means nil because of a single player?
    The point was 2 fold
    1. Using a singular person's viewpoint as the entire support of your position is not an adequate argument
    2. Pointing out 1 of Mayock's over the top statements doesn't hold much water. These guys are paid to continue to have something to say. That means you have to hype, or make grand statements, that's what gets printed, that's what people want to hear

    Mayock is a good talent evaluator, whose job is to write stories.

    NFL Drop Leaders: 2012-Jimmy Graham 2013-Brandon Marshall

    and in 2013 Graham had 3 drops, for a 2.1 % drop rate, and in 2011 he had 1 drop for a 1.4% drop rate.

    You won't have to search to hard to find my posts on how overrated Brandon Marshall is...

    I would also point out that you saw many more holes in Jarvis Jones's game but were pretty happy with the pick last season.
    I was right about Jones flaws and how it would impact what we were drafting him for. I said at the time that it was a good pick based on need, but that passing on Patterson would be a collossal mistake. I was right about that too.

    i saw one critical hole in Jones game (1st step, burst, explosion off the snap), a flaw that would hurt what we primarily were investing in him to do (sacks, pass rush).


    You are all in on trading up for Watkins, so you are cherry picking a single stat to eliminate Ebron. Ebron is seen by most as having excellent hands, and a guy who catches the ball away from his body. His drops were mostly "concentration drops", which is a problem easily rectified. His biggest issue by far, from the Steelers' perspective, should be that he cannot block a lick.
    Cherry picking a stat???? I am placing an emphasis on a skill that happens to be absolutely critical to him reaching his potential. There just so happens to be an objective stat that supports my subjective viewpoint of his ability

    I dont know who has you convinced that he has excellent hands. Anyone saying that hasn't watched anything but a highlight reel. He drops balls in every game.

    Probably going to happen and I am fine with it. I do not get so emotionally invested in a player that I cannot see the merits of others. Dennard, Gilbert, Evans, even Mosley would make me smile
    .

    Im not emotionally invested. Id be happy if we drafted any of those guys... well Mosley only if the others are off the board... Ebron would be a poor investment of a quality pick.... there will be too many players with equally high ceilings with less warts and questions marks available at that pick.
    Return of the Banana

  5. #25
    Assistant Coach steelchamp204's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    4,106
    Quote Originally Posted by K Train View Post
    In all seriousness I'd probably prefer ASJ or Niklas in 2 than Ebron in 1. But to me ebron is significantly safer if a pick that Benjamin and provides similar ability, but less upside.
    I highly doubt ASJ makes it to us in the 2nd. If he did, why would we go Ebron in the 1st???

    I still say the Steelers either take Mosley/Evans/Gilbert. If neither are there on the board, I think they trade back in the first.

  6. #26
    K Train's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    In hell
    Posts
    18,413
    Quote Originally Posted by steelchamp204 View Post
    I highly doubt ASJ makes it to us in the 2nd. If he did, why would we go Ebron in the 1st???

    I still say the Steelers either take Mosley/Evans/Gilbert. If neither are there on the board, I think they trade back in the first.
    Asj had a down year statistically but became more well rounded in the process. He also broke his foot at the combine, he could definitely be there In 2. Ebron has a but higher ceiling as a receiver.

  7. #27
    Veteran TarlsQtr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,837
    My Mood
    Ratbirds
    Quote Originally Posted by NeilPatrickBanana View Post
    The point was 2 fold
    1. Using a singular person's viewpoint as the entire support of your position is not an adequate argument
    Luckily, no one did that.

    2. Pointing out 1 of Mayock's over the top statements doesn't hold much water. These guys are paid to continue to have something to say. That means you have to hype, or make grand statements, that's what gets printed, that's what people want to hear
    Then why did your argument boil down to pointing out 1 "over the top" statement? And the one you pointed out was not even "over the top." Calling Gabbert the next Joe Montana would be "over the top" and subjective but he did not do that. That "he's the first QB off the board" is easily measurable. Mayock was wrong, but not catastrophically (over the top) wrong. Gabbert was chosen 10th overall and the 3rd QB. Your point does not even make your point.

    Mayock's comment about Ebron, was equally as objective. He said Ebron was a top 10 talent and if he fell out of the top 10 then he would not get past the Steelers at 15. Again, that is measurable. If he is drafted in the top 20 or so, will you admit that the comment was not "over the top?"

    and in 2013 Graham had 3 drops, for a 2.1 % drop rate, and in 2011 he had 1 drop for a 1.4% drop rate.
    Which just shows that cherry picking a season's drop stats is insufficient. It is a single data point (and I concede an important one).

    You won't have to search to hard to find my posts on how overrated Brandon Marshall is...
    If your analysis is anything but him being a top 5-10 WR, it is off.

    I was right about Jones flaws and how it would impact what we were drafting him for. I said at the time that it was a good pick based on need, but that passing on Patterson would be a collossal mistake. I was right about that too.
    But you were open to drafting him with his "flaw" in almost the exact same draft position.

    Cherry picking a stat???? I am placing an emphasis on a skill that happens to be absolutely critical to him reaching his potential. There just so happens to be an objective stat that supports my subjective viewpoint of his ability
    A single stat that illustrates (but does not even do that completely) a single element of his game.

    I dont know who has you convinced that he has excellent hands. Anyone saying that hasn't watched anything but a highlight reel. He drops balls in every game.
    Bleacher Report:

    Hands are fairly consistent.
    Majority of his drops are uncontested passes and simply due to a lack of focus.

    SB Nation: At times, Ebron's hands are faulty. A ball will hit off his fingertips or he'll let one into his pads and it will bounce away. But it doesn't happen quite enough to question Ebron's hands. He'll often extend out from his frame to make a difficult grab. He's capable of making the circus catch look routine. Has shown good concentration to follow the ball in the air instead of anticipating getting hit. There are times, however, where Ebron will look to get up the field before pulling the catch in. High points as good as many wide receivers.

    NFL.com: Outstanding athletic ability and receiving skills. Threatens every level. Advanced route runner. Releases cleanly and accelerates into patterns. Pierces the seam and is a mismatch vs. man coverage -- regularly bested defensive backs. Terrific balance, agility and body control. Catches cleanly off his frame. Makes one-handed grabs look routine. Big catch radius. Catches on the move and has an extra gear to pile up yards. Had 875 yards receiving as a junior, breaking Vernon Davis' ACC record. Will be a 21-year-old rookie. Ebron might not be in the "freak" category, but his speed, movement skills, hands and run-after-catch skill puts him in the next tier, as he has ample ability to be a playmaker at the next level. Negatives-Occasional concentration drop.

    CBS-Smooth adjustments to pluck the ball with his hands away from his body - large catching radius. Has his share of focus drops...


    The consensus is that he has good hands but loses focus, which matches what I have observed. He makes some absolutely freakish catches, which indicates his hands are just fine. He drops passes mainly when he loses concentration. That can be rectified. Poor hands cannot.
    "If I could start my life all over again, I would be a professional football player, and you damn well better believe I would be a Pittsburgh Steeler." -Jack Lambert

  8. #28
    Assistant Coach
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Posts
    4,699
    Quote Originally Posted by TarlsQtr View Post
    Luckily, no one did that.
    yea, you did. You said a whole bunch of nothing regarding Cook/Ebron comparison... it went something like, "It would be great if Ebron was as good as Cook should be if he was as good as Ebron is going to be ".... And then you pointed to Mayock

    Reminder: Mayock ranked Pettigrew 8th overall... he has a history with vastly overrating the drafts top TE. He called Jermaine Gresham an All Pro TE in his 2nd NFL season...

    Then why did your argument boil down to pointing out 1 "over the top" statement? And the one you pointed out was not even "over the top." Calling Gabbert the next Joe Montana would be "over the top" and subjective but he did not do that. That "he's the first QB off the board" is easily measurable. Mayock was wrong, but not catastrophically (over the top) wrong. Gabbert was chosen 10th overall and the 3rd QB. Your point does not even make your point.
    My argument boils down to a TE not having good hands. You should also understand that there is a difference between "Hands" and "Catch Technique". You keep bringing up aspects of catch technique (extension, plucking, radius, etc) to which I have no issue with Ebron.

    But he does NOT have good hands. "Concentration issues" is simply a cop out... and even if you are stuck using excuses because you can't see what's obvious... i'd offer that an egomaniac with concentration issues is a pretty horrible combination.

    Mayock's comment about Ebron, was equally as objective. He said Ebron was a top 10 talent and if he fell out of the top 10 then he would not get past the Steelers at 15. Again, that is measurable. If he is drafted in the top 20 or so, will you admit that the comment was not "over the top?"
    I don't think he's a top 20 talent in this draft... and thus believe calling him a top 10 talent in this draft is pretty over the top.


    Which just shows that cherry picking a season's drop stats is insufficient. It is a single data point (and I concede an important one).
    His drop rate represents his career... as did his pro day

    If your analysis is anything but him being a top 5-10 WR, it is off.
    My analysis is exactly that (not top 10). I know that's hard to understand in a fantasy football world. But Marshall is at the top of the league in drops and the bottom of the league in YAC every year. He's never showed up in big games, he falls off the earth in the 2nd half of seasons. He never carries his team anywhere. He's one of the most overrated players in football... I'm sure you can name other top 10 WRs who have been traded TWICE in their prime...

    But you were open to drafting him with his "flaw" in almost the exact same draft position.
    i was. In a draft that was nowhere near as deep in high level 1st round talent. If Ebron were in last year's draft, I'd be open to drafting him. I am not open to drafting him over the numerous other players I expect to be available. I didn't even expect Jarvis Jones to be available.

    A single stat that illustrates (but does not even do that completely) a single element of his game.
    First of all, it's the only available stat that illustrates it. Frankly, I wish we didn't have to use the stat and we could discuss actual games/plays. It's a single element of his game that happens to be the most important element

    It's the element that takes him off the board at 15 for me... but it's not the only flaw in his game. He's not going to be as uncoverable at the NFL level, his speed isn't that impressive. He's mobility in and out of routes IS off the charts, but I don't think he'll get the RAC in the NFL that he got in college.


    Bleacher Report:

    Hands are fairly consistent.
    Majority of his drops are uncontested passes and simply due to a lack of focus.

    SB Nation: At times, Ebron's hands are faulty. A ball will hit off his fingertips or he'll let one into his pads and it will bounce away. But it doesn't happen quite enough to question Ebron's hands. He'll often extend out from his frame to make a difficult grab. He's capable of making the circus catch look routine. Has shown good concentration to follow the ball in the air instead of anticipating getting hit. There are times, however, where Ebron will look to get up the field before pulling the catch in. High points as good as many wide receivers.

    NFL.com: Outstanding athletic ability and receiving skills. Threatens every level. Advanced route runner. Releases cleanly and accelerates into patterns. Pierces the seam and is a mismatch vs. man coverage -- regularly bested defensive backs. Terrific balance, agility and body control. Catches cleanly off his frame. Makes one-handed grabs look routine. Big catch radius. Catches on the move and has an extra gear to pile up yards. Had 875 yards receiving as a junior, breaking Vernon Davis' ACC record. Will be a 21-year-old rookie. Ebron might not be in the "freak" category, but his speed, movement skills, hands and run-after-catch skill puts him in the next tier, as he has ample ability to be a playmaker at the next level. Negatives-Occasional concentration drop.

    CBS-Smooth adjustments to pluck the ball with his hands away from his body - large catching radius. Has his share of focus drops...

    If I post the same sources statements on Brandon Pettigrew regarding his hands, and told you that he has one of the worst drop rates of any high target TE in the NFL over the last 5 years... would that make a difference?

    The consensus is that he has good hands but loses focus, which matches what I have observed. He makes some absolutely freakish catches, which indicates his hands are just fine. He drops passes mainly when he loses concentration. That can be rectified. Poor hands cannot.
    I disagree... losing concentration is a made up excuse for players who don't catch the ball well. It's not an innate/instictual skill they developed.

    I am interested in what other sources, qualified sources, have to say.. but that doesn't form the basis of my opinion. It will certainly point me in the direction plenty... but it doesn't change what I see.

    I question what you've observed.
    Return of the Banana

  9. #29
    Veteran TarlsQtr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,837
    My Mood
    Ratbirds
    Quote Originally Posted by NeilPatrickBanana View Post
    yea, you did. You said a whole bunch of nothing regarding Cook/Ebron comparison... it went something like, "It would be great if Ebron was as good as Cook should be if he was as good as Ebron is going to be ".... And then you pointed to Mayock
    That is a complete and utter falsehood. When you have to misrepresent what was said to prove your "point", perhaps the point was better off unmade.

    What I said was that Ebron had very similar measurables to Cook (height, size, strength, etc.) and even pointed out that Ebron is a bit slower than Cook. That is what people who are doing an honest assessment do. They even point out stats that go against their argument.

    What is even funnier is that you criticize my post as a "whole bunch of nothing" when it was a response to your post that said nothing more than "Ebron=Cook" and that our FO should not draft Ebron. If my post is a "bunch of nothing" is yours less than nothing or is that what you call "in depth" analysis?

    Reminder: Mayock ranked Pettigrew 8th overall... he has a history with vastly overrating the drafts top TE. He called Jermaine Gresham an All Pro TE in his 2nd NFL season...
    The biggest difference between you and Mayock, other than he would probably admit he is wrong, is that he is on the record with all of his thousands of evaluations. As the old Indian proverb stated, "Hindsight knowledge is of no use." No one knows where you had Pettigrew or anyone else ranked.

    My argument boils down to a TE not having good hands. You should also understand that there is a difference between "Hands" and "Catch Technique". You keep bringing up aspects of catch technique (extension, plucking, radius, etc) to which I have no issue with Ebron.
    Hands are part of catch technique but not it in sum. No one said otherwise. Not sure where I "keep bringing up" things like extension, plucking, radius, etc. I highlighted the aspect of other peoples' analysis and I think I highlighted "receiving skills" (hands being part of them) once. Never did I highlight "extension, etc... It is a red herring.

    But he does NOT have good hands. "Concentration issues" is simply a cop out... and even if you are stuck using excuses because you can't see what's obvious... i'd offer that an egomaniac with concentration issues is a pretty horrible combination.
    Not at all. Watch his tape. A very large percentage of his drops are caused by turning upfield just as the ball arrives. That is a much different problem than "bad hands" a la Dwight "Hands of" Stone.

    I don't think he's a top 20 talent in this draft... and thus believe calling him a top 10 talent in this draft is pretty over the top.
    This is a retreat in your position of course. The issue was being a top 10 talent and not falling past the Steelers. If he is drafted in the Top 15, at least the second part of his comment is correct. If in the top 10, probably both. If in the top 20, although technically wrong, it would be silly to call it "over the top" wrong. I would also point out that almost all draft gurus have him in that range. For instance, the CBS guys have him drafted at 12, 9, 15, and 21. NFL.com at 12, 17, 9, and 20. Bleacher Report at 18. Walter Football at 15. It seems like almost everyone is "over the top" but you.

    My analysis is exactly that (not top 10). I know that's hard to understand in a fantasy football world.
    Yeah, I know, everyone (but you) lives in a "fantasy football world."

    But Marshall is at the top of the league in drops and the bottom of the league in YAC every year. He's never showed up in big games, he falls off the earth in the 2nd half of seasons. He never carries his team anywhere. He's one of the most overrated players in football... I'm sure you can name other top 10 WRs who have been traded TWICE in their prime...
    Say all you want but there are not 10 WRs better right now. He has previously led the league in yards after first contact. Asomugha said he is the hardest to bring down one on one. The trade comment is just ignorant. The guy has a recognized mental illness (Borderline Personality Disorder) which helped result in those trades. He was traded mostly for mental instability, not poor play.

    It's the element that takes him off the board at 15 for me... but it's not the only flaw in his game. He's not going to be as uncoverable at the NFL level, his speed isn't that impressive. He's mobility in and out of routes IS off the charts, but I don't think he'll get the RAC in the NFL that he got in college.
    Which is fine. You do not think he is a player at 15, which is a legitimate position. Frankly, there are others that I would like more of those with a chance to be there. That said, being in disagreement with you does not mean evaluating talent like Al Davis or for fantasy football teams. Nor does being wrong about Blaine Gabbert mean Mayock is wrong about Eric Ebron.
    I am interested in what other sources, qualified sources, have to say..
    I disagree. Anyone who disagrees with you is either "over the top" or evaluates talent like Al Davis.

    ...but that doesn't form the basis of my opinion. It will certainly point me in the direction plenty... but it doesn't change what I see.
    Nor should it necessarily change your opinion. But when the consensus of "experts" seem to disagree with you, not to mention posters you respect such as K-Train and Big T, you should at least give pause.

    I question what you've observed.
    Which is fine. I will add that I sincerely respect your football knowledge. However, I suggest your biggest hole in talent evaluation has nothing to do with football, but a lack of humility.
    Last edited by TarlsQtr; 03-31-2014 at 08:59 AM.
    "If I could start my life all over again, I would be a professional football player, and you damn well better believe I would be a Pittsburgh Steeler." -Jack Lambert

  10. #30
    Assistant Coach
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Posts
    4,699
    Quote Originally Posted by TarlsQtr View Post
    The biggest difference between you and Mayock, other than he would probably admit he is wrong, is that he is on the record with all of his thousands of evaluations. As the old Indian proverb stated, "Hindsight knowledge is of no use." No one knows where you had Pettigrew or anyone else ranked.
    it's a good thing i'm building some history here.

    the larger point is that you know that Mayock and others will be wrong about a big handful of their prognostications for 1st rounders... yet, you will buy all of their prognosticating.

    Mayock is late getting on the Manziel bandwagon... a bandwagon I was on 6 months ago.

    Are there any highly touted prospects you disagree with?

    Hands are part of catch technique but not it in sum. No one said otherwise. Not sure where I "keep bringing up" things like extension, plucking, radius, etc. I highlighted the aspect of other peoples' analysis and I think I highlighted "receiving skills" (hands being part of them) once. Never did I highlight "extension, etc... It is a red herring.
    most of the quotes you provided dealt with highlighting technique, it was not a red herring. it was a topic you introduced.

    Not at all. Watch his tape. A very large percentage of his drops are caused by turning upfield just as the ball arrives. That is a much different problem than "bad hands" a la Dwight "Hands of" Stone.
    I don't believe you. I dont believe that you've watched Ebron that much. When you say "a very large percentage of his drops", i call bullshit. I think you trust far too much in what you read. and have corroborated very little of it, if any.

    vs Georgia Tech, you probably see the highlight reel 1 handed tap TD grab... i see the perfectly placed and dropped seam pattern and the off the hands stick route that landed in the opponents hands for a game killing INT.

    You probably see the gorgeous high point in coverage TD vs Virginia Tech... I see the ugly dropped crossing pattern and the lazy routes when he's not the primary. Although, I was encouraged by his effort in this regard later in the seaso.n

    You see the body contorting 1 handed highlight reel catch in a big game performance vs Miami... I see how when his right side is facing the LOS (mostly when working inside from the left side of the LOS) he allows the ball into his body, while when his routes face him the opposite way he has much better technique. I also don't forgive the TD he dropped... again which had nothing to do with "turning up field".

    You see the 80 yard/70 YAC catch and run vs Duke... i see that comeback drop via stone hands (again, not turning up field), and the crossing pattern drop (poor technique)... there was also the INT off his hands, but it was a terrible pass behind him... a couple other poorly thrown balls went of his hands that won't be credited as drops. He drops plenty of those, but of course only the highlight reel catches stand out... meanwhile, at the NFL level, he won't have a horrendous QB throwing balls into 20 foot windows. lol

    You probably saw that sick hurdle move vs Cinci...I see the ball hitting him in the Stone hands again on an 8 yard out (again, not looking upfield...) and even worse, an inside out double move for a TD that he drops right in the bread basket (similar to the seam drop vs Tech).

    That 50 yd YAC play vs Pitt is pretty damn enticing... but just a few plays later he drops another crossing play while going to the ground (oh... and stays down injured... something he does a lot when he drops a ball)

    Dont forget Eastern Carolina and the Stone Hands TD drop

    So... did you watch any of these games? That's 10 of his 13 drops.... none of them were "while turning up field". Did you just make that up? Or did you read it somewhere?

    "Concentration Issues" is a bunch of nonsense that you drank....

    Ironically, the pundits knock Ebron for his blocking, when it should be considered a strength given the type of offensive weapon he is. He is a very good blocker on the outside, he wins his share of inline point of attack blocks, and he's obviously adept at getting to the 2nd level... he'd be great in a zone scheme.

    This is a retreat in your position of course. The issue was being a top 10 talent and not falling past the Steelers. If he is drafted in the Top 15, at least the second part of his comment is correct. If in the top 10, probably both. If in the top 20, although technically wrong, it would be silly to call it "over the top" wrong. I would also point out that almost all draft gurus have him in that range. For instance, the CBS guys have him drafted at 12, 9, 15, and 21. NFL.com at 12, 17, 9, and 20. Bleacher Report at 18. Walter Football at 15. It seems like almost everyone is "over the top" but you.
    I think there is a big difference between big board rankings and mock draft position. I think he'll go to the Giants. The NFL draft is NOT a BPA draft... it's a needs based draft.

    Yeah, I know, everyone (but you) lives in a "fantasy football world."
    yes, lots of people do.
    Say all you want but there are not 10 WRs better right now.
    we can get into this another time....


    Which is fine. You do not think he is a player at 15, which is a legitimate position. Frankly, there are others that I would like more of those with a chance to be there. That said, being in disagreement with you does not mean evaluating talent like Al Davis or for fantasy football teams. Nor does being wrong about Blaine Gabbert mean Mayock is wrong about Eric Ebron.
    im fine with being wrong. Ebron proving me wrong won't be surprising. He has the high end athletic talent to do it. The point is that you referencing other evaluators and pretending to have "observed" the same isn't much of an argument. in my eyes.

    I disagree. Anyone who disagrees with you is either "over the top" or evaluates talent like Al Davis.
    disagree with me with your own perspective. not just what you read.

    I DO think that calling him a top 10 talent (mayock) is over the top.... which players are not top 10 talents for that to be true.... Manziel? Mack? Watkins? Robinson? Matthews? Gilbert? Dennard? Evans? Barr? Clowney? Bortles? Donald? I could go on.... And yes, I do think that Athleticism is overrated by many evaluators, and that athleticism fails to overcome flawed football talent very often.

    Nor should it necessarily change your opinion. But when the consensus of "experts" seem to disagree with you, not to mention posters you respect suck as K-Train and Big T, you should at least give pause.
    that's how I become "fine with" Jarvis Jones...

    Quote Originally Posted by TarlsQtr View Post
    Which is fine. I will add that I sincerely respect your football knowledge. However, I suggest your biggest hole in talent evaluation has nothing to do with football, but a lack of humility.
    i know
    Last edited by NeilPatrickBanana; 03-31-2014 at 11:53 PM.
    Return of the Banana

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-22-2012, 09:05 PM
  2. if you had on board.....
    By acero in forum Steelers Talk
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 04-14-2012, 12:15 AM
  3. Fix/Save the Steelers Official Message Board Petition
    By Katmandu in forum Steelers Talk
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 10-24-2011, 10:26 AM
  4. Possible Steelers Draft Board
    By darnik44 in forum Steelers War Room
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 02-07-2009, 02:48 AM
  5. Steelers Draft Board
    By darnik44 in forum Steelers War Room
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-22-2008, 06:57 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •