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Thread: How to rank QBs (an honest discussion)

          
   
   
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  1. #31
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    Talent has nothing to do with any of those things.
    You are right, a lack of talent does.

    Ben has 2 rings too.

    The fact that Ben's not a Manning and doesn't kiss media *** (which is why he didn't win MVP) means nothing to me.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash View Post
    You are right, a lack of talent does.

    Ben has 2 rings too.

    The fact that Ben's not a Manning and doesn't kiss media *** (which is why he didn't win MVP) means nothing to me.
    Your conspiracy theories mean nothing

    Ben and Eli have both had up and down regular seasons
    Both have showed up big time in certain playoff runs
    Both have 2 rings
    One of them has 2 MVPs

    Those are facts. They aren't opinions or theories or lunatic conspiracy theories. And it's not "spin" like you so often attempt. It's straight simple fact... So when giving them a score in the category of "Career", Eli clearly has the SLIGHT edge

    Now, if you want to debate "TALENT", I'd be glad to. But you've demonstrated no ability to get into the details of QB talents.

    Days since it was noted that Crash is afraid to post a QB ranking of his own : 5
    My Steeler Mock Draft
    1. Darqueze Dennard, CB Mich St
    2. Allen Robinson, WR Penn St
    3. Carl Bradford, OLB Arizona St
    4. Martavis Bryant, WR Clemson
    5a. Brent Urban, DE Virginia
    5b. Kevin Pierre-Louis, ILB Boston College
    6. Dontae Johnson, CB North Carolina St
    7. Zach Kerr, NT Delaware

  3. #33
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    Ben and Eli have both had up and down regular seasons
    That is incorrect, Ben by far is the more consistent of the two. It's not even close when you ignore Eli's last name.

    Eli has two regular seasons with a passer rating of 90 or better in 9 years. Ben has seven in 9 years.

    Ben's career passer rating is 10 points HIGHER. That is a significant jump. Eli has had 4 of nine season where his passer rating was under 80 FFS, Ben did it once in 9 years.

    Ben's TD percentage is better, and his INT percentage is better also.

    Eli's CAREER passing completion rate is under 59 percent. Ben? 63 percent. YPA? A mere 7.1 compared to Ben's 7.9.

    Eli has started 9 more regular season games than Ben, and yet has 9 LESS wins than Ben does.

    So when giving them a score in the category of "Career", Eli clearly has the SLIGHT edge
    Then you can't rank Peyton ahead of Ben.

    Sorry, not possible.

    Ben AND Eli have BOTH been better than Peyton in the playoffs.

    If you want to rank Eli ahead of Ben? Then Ben MUST be ranked higher than Peyton if the agenda is not anti-Roethlisberger.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash View Post
    That is incorrect, Ben by far is the more consistent of the two. It's not even close when you ignore Eli's last name.

    Eli has two regular seasons with a passer rating of 90 or better in 9 years. Ben has seven in 9 years.

    Ben's career passer rating is 10 points HIGHER. That is a significant jump. Eli has had 4 of nine season where his passer rating was under 80 FFS, Ben did it once in 9 years.

    Ben's TD percentage is better, and his INT percentage is better also.

    Eli's CAREER passing completion rate is under 59 percent. Ben? 63 percent. YPA? A mere 7.1 compared to Ben's 7.9.

    Eli has started 9 more regular season games than Ben, and yet has 9 LESS wins than Ben does.
    Wow... look at all these factors that come into the picture when you need to defend Ben. Funny how Regular season passer rating, TD to INT ratio, Comp percent... all of these stats mean NOTHING to you when discussing Peyton and Brady.

    Again... this is why you won't post a list. Because your inconsistency will be torn to shreds... you're scared, it shows.


    Then you can't rank Peyton ahead of Ben.

    Sorry, not possible.

    Ben AND Eli have BOTH been better than Peyton in the playoffs.

    If you want to rank Eli ahead of Ben? Then Ben MUST be ranked higher than Peyton if the agenda is not anti-Roethlisberger.
    Again... you have trouble understanding the concept of an "overall" rating based on 4 distinct ratings. 2 of those ratings being very opinionated and 2 of those ratings being derived from results/stats.

    That was the entire purpose of this thread.

    Would you like to provide a measurable criteria of your own... something that is consistently applied across all QBs? Because right now, you choose a narrow minded criteria for each QB that allows you to pidgeon hole them into your belief.
    Example... for Peyton, all you look at is playoff losses. For Brady, all you look at is NOT winning a super bowl the last 7 years.

    Days since it was noted that Crash is afraid to post a QB ranking of his own : 5
    My Steeler Mock Draft
    1. Darqueze Dennard, CB Mich St
    2. Allen Robinson, WR Penn St
    3. Carl Bradford, OLB Arizona St
    4. Martavis Bryant, WR Clemson
    5a. Brent Urban, DE Virginia
    5b. Kevin Pierre-Louis, ILB Boston College
    6. Dontae Johnson, CB North Carolina St
    7. Zach Kerr, NT Delaware

  5. #35
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    Example... for Peyton, all you look at is playoff losses.
    Incorrect as usual. I also mention the fact that the alleged most talented QB ever, in his lone SB winning season, was carried by his running game and his defense when he threw 3 TD passes and 7 picks in four games.

    For Brady, all you look at is NOT winning a super bowl the last 7 years.
    Once again, incorrect as usual. I look at the fact that since Brady and his team were caught CHEATING, that the same player who was being considered the best QB in playoff history, all of the sudden looks pretty ordinary in the playoffs.

    You can't ignore Brady's performances in the playoffs pre and post Spygate if you want to be taken seriously.

    Sorry.

    The ONLY thing Peyton has over Ben was a dome and a 6 year head start to his regular season stat pile.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash View Post
    Incorrect as usual. I also mention the fact that the alleged most talented QB ever, in his lone SB winning season, was carried by his running game and his defense when he threw 3 TD passes and 7 picks in four games.
    You are the gift that keeps on giving. Please... never leave.

    Anyway... again, you referred to post season only. Unlike your Ben/Eli argument where you are differentiating between regular season performance, QB ratings, TD/INT ratios...

    This reply is easily my favorite yet... your rebuttal to being accused of only looking at the playoffs.... was to refer to the playoffs. lol



    Once again, incorrect as usual. I look at the fact that since Brady and his team were caught CHEATING, that the same player who was being considered the best QB in playoff history, all of the sudden looks pretty ordinary in the playoffs.
    The regular season, which you gave so much weight to when debating Ben v Eli... suddenly... evaporates. Again, you've been called out for using selective criteria, and your response was to again use selective criteria.

    You can't ignore Brady's performances in the playoffs pre and post Spygate if you want to be taken seriously.
    You can't ignore Brady's entire regular season career if you want to be taken seriously. It's also ridiculous that you see no value in his 2 trips to the super bowl, in which he was on the verge of winning if not for defensive collapses... oh wait, defensive collapses late in the 4th quarter are a Big Ben excuse only....

    Not to mention, that during those 2 trips to the super bow... he hardly looked ordinary. But i guess, unless you are Ben, you are expected to be amazing in every post season... a criteria, that no one would live up to in today's NFL.

    3 of Ben's last 4 post seasons ended with Passer Ratings in the 70s.. with 7 TDs... and 10 turnovers... I guess his one super bowl win erases everything else. But not for Peyton it doesnt.

    If your criteria is to only view post season, then I suggest you revisit your Ben v Eli argument

    Who has a Better post season passer rating:
    Eli 89.3
    Ben 83.7

    Who has a better Post season TD/INT Ratio:
    Eli 17 : 8
    Ben 20 : 17

    Sorry.

    The ONLY thing Peyton has over Ben was a dome and a 6 year head start to his regular season stat pile.
    And a vastly superior football IQ and a more accurate arm



    Days since it was noted that Crash is afraid to post a QB ranking of his own : 5
    Last edited by NeilPatrickBanana; 02-12-2013 at 05:09 PM.
    My Steeler Mock Draft
    1. Darqueze Dennard, CB Mich St
    2. Allen Robinson, WR Penn St
    3. Carl Bradford, OLB Arizona St
    4. Martavis Bryant, WR Clemson
    5a. Brent Urban, DE Virginia
    5b. Kevin Pierre-Louis, ILB Boston College
    6. Dontae Johnson, CB North Carolina St
    7. Zach Kerr, NT Delaware

  7. #37
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    And a vastly superior football IQ and a more accurate arm
    His playoff performances disagree with you.

    Only a Manning apologist gets happy when he feasts on regular season doormats.

    But in the post season? Not so much.

    Don't feel too bad though, that's been Peyton's calling card since college.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash View Post
    His playoff performances disagree with you.

    Only a Manning apologist gets happy when he feasts on regular season doormats.

    But in the post season? Not so much.

    Don't feel too bad though, that's been Peyton's calling card since college.
    Post Season Passer Rating :
    Peyton 88.4
    Ben 83.7

    you keep losing... it's getting funnier
    My Steeler Mock Draft
    1. Darqueze Dennard, CB Mich St
    2. Allen Robinson, WR Penn St
    3. Carl Bradford, OLB Arizona St
    4. Martavis Bryant, WR Clemson
    5a. Brent Urban, DE Virginia
    5b. Kevin Pierre-Louis, ILB Boston College
    6. Dontae Johnson, CB North Carolina St
    7. Zach Kerr, NT Delaware

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeilPatrickBanana View Post
    Post Season Passer Rating :
    Peyton 88.4
    Ben 83.7

    you keep losing... it's getting funnier
    Please. Took Peyton, the alleged most talented QB ever SIX YEARS to win a playoff game.

    Not even Kordell Stewart took that long.

    Wake me up when Peyton has a post season as good as 2005 Ben. Hell 2008 Ben too.

    Overrated dome throwing stat whore.

    BFD.

  10. #40
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    Who has a Better post season passer rating:
    Eli 89.3
    Ben 83.7

    Who has a better Post season TD/INT Ratio:
    Eli 17 : 8
    Ben 20 : 17
    My Steeler Mock Draft
    1. Darqueze Dennard, CB Mich St
    2. Allen Robinson, WR Penn St
    3. Carl Bradford, OLB Arizona St
    4. Martavis Bryant, WR Clemson
    5a. Brent Urban, DE Virginia
    5b. Kevin Pierre-Louis, ILB Boston College
    6. Dontae Johnson, CB North Carolina St
    7. Zach Kerr, NT Delaware

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