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View Full Version : Bell and Redman Injured



TarlsQtr
08-15-2013, 11:51 PM
It does not look too serious but one or both may miss Monday night.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/23166870/top-2-rbs-bell-redman-injured-at-steelers-practice-thursday/23166870/top-2-rbs-bell-redman-injured-at-steelers-practice-thursday



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wyn50
08-16-2013, 04:32 AM
Save the rough stuff for the season. Bring back camp cupcake. :)

Big T
08-16-2013, 12:51 PM
@rayfitt1: LeVeon Bell said he would like to play Monday. Confirmed what Tomlin said last night, an aggravation of previous knee bruise.

@rayfitt1: Bell said he slowed down and let up a little too much on the play. Did not blame defense for the injury. Said he just fell on the knee.

steelchamp204
08-16-2013, 03:15 PM
Bell needs to get some in game reps. Keep him out until week 3 of preseason, now later.

LatrobePA
08-16-2013, 03:57 PM
Bell needs to get some in game reps. Keep him out until week 3 of preseason, now later.

Sit him!!

Real Deal Steel
08-16-2013, 04:00 PM
Bell is a rookie. He needs to play in both games 2 & 3

Big T
08-16-2013, 05:34 PM
@rayfitt1: Tomlin on Bell: "He has a clean bill of health and it's time to get back out here an start the process of readying himself for the game."

@rayfitt1: Bell was a limited participant in practice and had no contact. Redman also limited with no contact.

SnakeEyes43
08-16-2013, 06:34 PM
Bell was very durable as a Spartan, so I'm not worried yet.

From what I read, Redman just got his clock cleaned by Foote, which actually put a smile on my face.

LatrobePA
08-16-2013, 06:57 PM
Bell needs to play Monday, sit him for a few days.

Big T
08-17-2013, 01:44 AM
‏@jimwexell Le'Veon Bell: Aggravated bruise. No MCL damage. No tears at all. Says will play Monday.

Big T
08-19-2013, 03:22 PM
@rayfitt1: RT @gerrydulac: Le'Veon Bell well enough to play and expected to go vs Redskins.

LatrobePA
08-19-2013, 04:50 PM
Good deal!

Real Deal Steel
08-19-2013, 11:36 PM
I guess it wasn't. :(

Looks like Dwyer is the opening day starter.

LevonKirkland99
08-19-2013, 11:45 PM
Bell injured again? we can't draft a good RB for God's sake...

SteelCurtainYinzer
08-20-2013, 12:05 AM
just heard and then read that Bell has an ankle sprain and will be out several weeks. They are going to check for ligament damage tomorrow. We are already thin at TE, WR and now RB. Remember the good ole days when we worried about problems with Offensive line? I'd take that over what is going on right now.

Big T
08-20-2013, 12:22 AM
just heard and then read that Bell has an ankle sprain and will be out several weeks. They are going to check for ligament damage tomorrow. We are already thin at TE, WR and now RB. Remember the good ole days when we worried about problems with Offensive line? I'd take that over what is going on right now.

Not sure where you saw that...

@steelers: Coach Tomlin says @L_Bell26 has a mid-foot injury and will be evaluated again tomorrow. LaRod didn't play due to a knee strain (not major).

@EdBouchette: Steelers Bell has mid foot sprain. MRI Tuesday

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 06:25 AM
How about a Frank Summers flash back... He is in a Tomlin camp and gets his backed cracked on a dirty hit in practice, really never was the same after that.. I know he wasn't that good but he was wearing B&G.

Bell gets a bad hit in practice to the knee ... Shouldn't have played in the game last night... Now well see him T-Day...

Players are getting a bit stupid on this team... Tomlin may need to go...

K Train
08-20-2013, 08:26 AM
Bell injured again? we can't draft a good RB for God's sake...

Lets take it easy

TarlsQtr
08-20-2013, 08:44 AM
Lets take it easy

We are doomed! LOL

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 08:58 AM
I don't think this is an over reaction K.
The kid has had virtually no preseason real game work. So we can't expect him to be effective in the season opener. Dwyer will probably start with Bell mixed in (hopefully)

TarlsQtr
08-20-2013, 09:09 AM
I don't think this is an over reaction K.
The kid has had virtually no preseason real game work. So we can't expect him to be effective in the season opener. Dwyer will probably start with Bell mixed in (hopefully)

The other poster stated "We can't draft a good RB."

K said that is an overreaction.

You claim otherwise and then say that Dwyer may have to start the season opener with Bell hopefully mixed in. If it goes down that way, how does it mean that "we can't draft a good RB?"

Bell will STILL be a good RB, he just may not be ready to take over on week one. It is a HUGE overreaction.

Missing a game or two (if he does) at the beginning of the season=/=We can't draft a good RB

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 09:28 AM
I don't think this is an over reaction K.
The kid has had virtually no preseason real game work. So we can't expect him to be effective in the season opener. Dwyer will probably start with Bell mixed in (hopefully)

Whats wrong with Dwyer?? If he played in SF with the read option he would be a golden boy.
He ran for some nice plays when the line played ok..
Tomlin should have thrown the red flag on the Dwyer fumble just to show he cares about his players. it was close to a knee down....

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 09:32 AM
I'm not saying anything is wrong with Dwyer per say, I'm just dissapointed in what has transpired with Bell so far. But it's not a lost cause or anything.

But the play of the starting O-line? That is alarming. Karrigan of the redskins manhandled people (do I really have to say his name?) when they were pressuring Ben. Next week, I'm anxious to see the play of the O-line again. They are under the microscope IMO.

TarlsQtr
08-20-2013, 09:52 AM
I'm not saying anything is wrong with Dwyer per say, I'm just dissapointed in what has transpired with Bell so far. But it's not a lost cause or anything.

But the play of the starting O-line? That is alarming. Karrigan of the redskins manhandled people (do I really have to say his name?) when they were pressuring Ben. Next week, I'm anxious to see the play of the O-line again. They are under the microscope IMO.

Dwyer looked as nimble as I have ever seen him. I was actually impressed by him for the first time. Even in his short gains, it seemed like he was making the first guy miss.

Kerrigan had a good game but note that he knew the screen was coming according to an article I read this morning. Fletcher recognized the formation and yelled to him to watch the screen. I assume (hope) we would do a better job disguising in the regular season.

The line did look awful though. However, there are a lot of guys playing new positions and Decastro/Adams are glorified rookies. It will hopefully come together. The biggest disappointment on the line last night was Pouncey.

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 10:13 AM
Fletcher recognized the formation and yelled to him to watch the screen..

Was that a clue for Ben to do something else? Maybe even take a few more steps back?

Big T
08-20-2013, 10:21 AM
Tomlin should have thrown the red flag on the Dwyer fumble just to show he cares about his players. it was close to a knee down....

Probably one of the most ridiculous things I've read in a while.

TarlsQtr
08-20-2013, 10:24 AM
Was that a clue for Ben to do something else? Maybe even take a few more steps back?

I doubt he was listening, as he was probably going through his pre-snap reads. Admittedly though, I saw that the ball was going to be at least batted down 2-3 seconds before he threw it. It is not a good sign when the D player backs away from the lineman on a screen...

TarlsQtr
08-20-2013, 10:25 AM
Probably one of the most ridiculous things I've read in a while.

Then you did not read the game thread from last night. ;-)

Big T
08-20-2013, 10:32 AM
Then you did not read the game thread from last night. ;-)

Oh I did. Hence the "one of" lol. I love Preseason overreactions. "We're gonna have a top 10 pick"... Bell sprains his foot so that means he's terrible lol. It's all very amusing.

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 11:23 AM
Probably one of the most ridiculous things I've read in a while.

Really... Tomlin has a problem with a RB fumble and loses his mind... That was a close play that deserved a red flag.
Why doesn't he have a fit when Ben tosses the ball to the DL for 6 points...?

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 12:07 PM
Oh I did. Hence the "one of" lol. I love Preseason overreactions. "We're gonna have a top 10 pick"... Bell sprains his foot so that means he's terrible lol. It's all very amusing.

We're going to have a top 10 pick??? Who said this???

Big T
08-20-2013, 12:14 PM
We're going to have a top 10 pick??? Who said this???

More than one person actually.

WindyCityShaker
08-20-2013, 12:15 PM
Really... Tomlin has a problem with a RB fumble and loses his mind... That was a close play that deserved a red flag.
Why doesn't he have a fit when Ben tosses the ball to the DL for 6 points...?

You can't just throw a flag to show you are backing your players. That was a CLEAR fumble, one look at replay showed that. Isn't one of the many Tomlin faults, his inappropriate challenging of many plays, now he makes the right decision and that's not good enough?

If he lost his mind maybe it's because someone needs to step up. The running game has been a disappointment for how long exactly? Your starting back gets knocked out with an injury and one of the guys you're counting on to step up and step in puts the ball on the ground, not on a jarring hit like Shamarko delivered, but on play that shouldn't have been fumbled, at a drive killing point where a fumble is absolutely unacceptable!

You can fix mental errors, or bad decision making; it is much harder to correct physical errors due to lack of focus, and lack of desire to prove yourself.

Big T
08-20-2013, 12:17 PM
Really... Tomlin has a problem with a RB fumble and loses his mind... That was a close play that deserved a red flag.
Why doesn't he have a fit when Ben tosses the ball to the DL for 6 points...?

Deserved a red flag? Did you not see the replay? It was clearly a fumble. Mike Tomlin has guys upstairs that are watching the same replays we are. Not to mention the fact that all turnovers are automatically reviewed. Not sure what point you're trying to make.

LatrobePA
08-20-2013, 12:18 PM
Preseason overreaction?? lmfao bro, this team is starting off where they left off as an 8-8 team last season. Call it what you want they stunk up the joint!

Not ready to write the season off but it is what it is, a crap performance so far, not impressed with anything on offense. I do think the D will keep this team in a few games. They look good!

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 12:33 PM
. The running game has been a disappointment for how long exactly? Your starting back gets knocked out with an injury and one of the guys you're counting on to step up and step in puts the ball on the ground, not on a jarring hit like Shamarko delivered, but on play that shouldn't have been fumbled, at a drive killing point where a fumble is absolutely unacceptable!

.

Starter?? Bell?? He has 0 games under his belt..
The OL stopped dead and went backwards and Dwyers ran into Pounceys rear end and the DL guy somehow hit the ball on the nose while Dwyers was down....

Maybe not down, but his knee was very close to down as the ball was hit..

Anyway... Ben had the whopper play of the day!

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 12:34 PM
Preseason overreaction?? lmfao bro, this team is starting off where they left off as an 8-8 team last season. Call it what you want they stunk up the joint!

Not ready to write the season off but it is what it is, a crap performance so far, not impressed with anything on offense. I do think the D will keep this team in a few games. They look good!

Except for Gay, watching another easy TD catch in front of him.

LatrobePA
08-20-2013, 12:36 PM
Except for Gay, watching another easy TD catch in front of him.

Stop it! He's the greatest...

Where this team messed up is not bringing in a veteran RB...

steelchamp204
08-20-2013, 12:40 PM
If we are going to knock guys, why does Pouncey get a pass?? Or Adams, or DeCastro, and Foster is frustrating to watch.

Big T
08-20-2013, 12:42 PM
If we are going to knock guys, why does Pouncey get a pass?? Or Adams, or DeCastro, and Foster is frustrating to watch.

You clearly haven't been reading the comments on here if you think Pouncey is getting "a pass"

WindyCityShaker
08-20-2013, 12:45 PM
Starter?? Bell?? He has 0 games under his belt..
The OL stopped dead and went backwards and Dwyers ran into Pounceys rear end and the DL guy somehow hit the ball on the nose while Dwyers was down....

Maybe not down, but his knee was very close to down as the ball was hit..

Anyway... Ben had the whopper play of the day!

Hmm I thought that was Bell out on the field at the START of the game, I just assumed that made him the STARTER.

Look I like Dwyer, always have, but he has an opportunity. If he cannot do anything with it in pre-season, can you expect him to be any better when the games count?

acero
08-20-2013, 12:46 PM
kendrell bell?

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 12:47 PM
You clearly haven't been reading the comments on here if you think Pouncey is getting "a pass"

No..Pouncey hasn't been getting a pass from anyone I've read.

coldrolled
08-20-2013, 02:36 PM
If he cannot do anything with it in pre-season

He looked the strongest and best so far... I think he needs some credit for that... Hes a year older than Bell. Not bad right?
We have a great duo here. Bell needs to get healthy now.

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 09:29 PM
Here's a report on Bell from Rotoword.com

Le'Veon Bell - RB - Steelers

Steelers RB Le'Veon Bell has been diagnosed with a mid-foot sprain, and could be sidelined "a while."
It appears Bell has avoided a Lisfranc injury, but as top Steelers beat writer Ed Bouchette points out, any mid-foot sprain is a big issue for a running back. It's safe to rule Bell out for the rest of the preseason, and consider him questionable for Week 1. Bell has 19 days to get healthy. The Steelers would likely go with a committee of Isaac Redman, Jonathan Dwyer and La'Rod Stephens-Howling in the opener if their prized rookie runner isn't ready. The Steelers seem to have a remarkably difficult time keeping linemen and runners healthy.

Source: Ed Bouchette on Twitter

Real Deal Steel
08-20-2013, 09:30 PM
Dwyer and Howling are the starters. Let's get them ready to roll so they'll be as sharp as possible against the Titans.

LatrobePA
08-20-2013, 09:42 PM
I hate RB by committee.. It brings back bad memories!

Mike Tomlin
08-21-2013, 02:43 AM
I doubt he was listening, as he was probably going through his pre-snap reads. Admittedly though, I saw that the ball was going to be at least batted down 2-3 seconds before he threw it. It is not a good sign when the D player backs away from the lineman on a screen...

At that point Gilbert was suppose to chop down the defender to give Ben a clear lane to throw the screen. I mean even after Ben threw it Gilbert could have still cut him down and at least caused him to drop it or even miss it completely. He showed no hustle at all, Gilbert looks like he was just going through the motions . I was watching Gilbert in an interview and it seems to me like he's not taking the demotion from left tackle well. I mean he said some of the right things but his body language and mumbling said something else.

K Train
08-21-2013, 08:19 AM
RBBC isnt bad if they are productive, when its dwyer and redman sucking complete *** then year thats terrible. We dont need a fantasy back, but we need substantially more production

Real Deal Steel
08-21-2013, 12:48 PM
Well, Dwyer looks like he's in waaaay better shape this year and he looked good. Thank God for that because we are going to need him against the Titans.

As far as Gilbert is concerned, Tomlin needs to get in his @ss if he's still having issues. Oh..that would require Tomlin being a real coach wouldn't it? My bad.

Nolrog
08-21-2013, 01:05 PM
Reports coming out that the Steelers are looking for a second opinion on Bell's MRI. That doesn't make me all warm and fuzzy inside.

K Train
08-21-2013, 01:20 PM
i think they just want to make sure its not a lisfrac, which would suckkkk

LatrobePA
08-21-2013, 01:45 PM
I can't stomach Redman, please heal quick Bell!

Big T
08-21-2013, 02:11 PM
@JayGlazer: Steelers believe Le'Veon Bell has Lis Franc injury they r hoping will not require surgery but won't be sure until he gets it double checked

NeilPatrickBanana
08-21-2013, 02:33 PM
i think they just want to make sure its not a lisfrac, which would suckkkk

looks like it is...

it sure would be nice to have bradshaw now

camays2
08-21-2013, 02:40 PM
looks like it is...

it sure would be nice to have bradshaw now

I would get Brandon Jacobs cheap

K Train
08-21-2013, 02:41 PM
mcgahee?

K Train
08-21-2013, 02:42 PM
Not only have i been totally unexcited about bell from day one, but now it looks like his rookie year might be a wash.


should have kept mendenhall on a 1 year deal

NeilPatrickBanana
08-21-2013, 02:51 PM
Not only have i been totally unexcited about bell from day one, but now it looks like his rookie year might be a wash.


should have kept mendenhall on a 1 year deal

not sure how someone could be a fan of mendenhall... and not like Bell... they are similar runners who lack anything resembling big play capability...

we should've signed a some more competition for camp...

at this point, i dont think Mcgahee is an upgrade from Redman

maybe they should give a different Spartan a chance... Javon Ringer?

K Train
08-21-2013, 02:57 PM
Mendenhall looked pretty good the other night, seems fully recovered. Bradshaw is certainly not better than mendenhall

Mcgahee is definitely an upgrade over redman. Youd really have to try hard to find a back that isnt an upgrade over redman, but id put ringer in that category lol.

I do like the idea of the new dwyer and LSH, but damn this sucks

Niners have a **** load of backs....Gore, Hunter, James, Dixon, Jacobs, and Lattimore....borderline greedy right there

coldrolled
08-21-2013, 03:18 PM
This is too easy now.. I have to say.. a TE in the second.

NeilPatrickBanana
08-21-2013, 04:39 PM
Mendenhall looked pretty good the other night, seems fully recovered. Bradshaw is certainly not better than mendenhall

Mcgahee is definitely an upgrade over redman. Youd really have to try hard to find a back that isnt an upgrade over redman, but id put ringer in that category lol.

I do like the idea of the new dwyer and LSH, but damn this sucks

Niners have a **** load of backs....Gore, Hunter, James, Dixon, Jacobs, and Lattimore....borderline greedy right there

your opinion on redman is in the extreme, which means its more emotion than analysis
mcgahee is done...
redman can plow into the line and pass protect just as good... mcgahee is not an upgrade. this is non negotiable

have you ever seen ringer play? his career was quickly derailed by injuries. and he may never recover... but id rather bring a young, cut back runner who is only 26... then bring in mcgahee's badly beaten up body in just because he's a name. 32 yrs old, 2200+ touches, history of injuries = game over

K Train
08-21-2013, 04:50 PM
your opinion on redman is in the extreme, which means its more emotion than analysis
mcgahee is done...
redman can plow into the line and pass protect just as good... mcgahee is not an upgrade. this is non negotiable

have you ever seen ringer play? his career was quickly derailed by injuries. and he may never recover... but id rather bring a young, cut back runner who is only 26... then bring in mcgahee's badly beaten up body in just because he's a name. 32 yrs old, 2200+ touches, history of injuries = game over

redman is terrible, he been a completely replaceable player since day one. He has great balance and decent pass blocking skills but he is gary russell....forgettable, even if he can score a few TDs...oh and just to be clear, for being a "short yardage, powerback, goal line specialist" his 5 career TDs is completely underwhelming, which is essentially gary russells stat line. Then we can also continue to talk about what a completely terrible fit he is for a zone scheme.

Ive seen plenty of ringer, that would be like bringing in baron batch though, lateral move. Mcgahee wouldnt come in to be THE guy be he could be A guy. Same with Turner, doesnt have that same burst he used to but even without that, its more burst than redman. Dan Kreider had more explosion off the snap than redman does. If they toyed with the idea of tiki barber a few years ago, these guys should be taken a look at.

Bradshaw is younger than turner or mcgahee, but hes also got feet made out of corn flakes.

Definitely going to be interesting, ive never been excited about bell but at least there was some curiosity there....seems they are going in with the same ****** backfield as last year. At least dwyer looks like hes slimmed down and they added LSH, but could be another rough year for the run game

Blount also might not make the roster in NE...not a good fit, but still probably better than redman

NeilPatrickBanana
08-21-2013, 05:11 PM
redman is terrible, he been a completely replaceable player since day one. He has great balance and decent pass blocking skills but he is gary russell....forgettable, even if he can score a few TDs...oh and just to be clear, for being a "short yardage, powerback, goal line specialist" his 5 career TDs is completely underwhelming, which is essentially gary russells stat line. Then we can also continue to talk about what a completely terrible fit he is for a zone scheme.

Ive seen plenty of ringer, that would be like bringing in baron batch though, lateral move. Mcgahee wouldnt come in to be THE guy be he could be A guy. Same with Turner, doesnt have that same burst he used to but even without that, its more burst than redman. Dan Kreider had more explosion off the snap than redman does. If they toyed with the idea of tiki barber a few years ago, these guys should be taken a look at.

Bradshaw is younger than turner or mcgahee, but hes also got feet made out of corn flakes.

Definitely going to be interesting, ive never been excited about bell but at least there was some curiosity there....seems they are going in with the same ****** backfield as last year. At least dwyer looks like hes slimmed down and they added LSH, but could be another rough year for the run game

Blount also might not make the roster in NE...not a good fit, but still probably better than redman

i cant even take you seriously anymore when it comes to Redman... you're a smart guy, but you have an RDS style when it comes to redman...

2012
turner 3.6
redman 3.7

i dont care about redman one way or the other... we dont have a feature capable back IMO.

Real Deal Steel
08-21-2013, 06:26 PM
After watching Mcgahee last year, he is much more then Redman. Mcgahee could help if healthy.

LatrobePA
08-21-2013, 06:30 PM
Should of brought in a solid RB this off season. Relying on a rookie is always risky and the other two stiffs we have aren't gonna cut it!

K Train
08-21-2013, 07:04 PM
i cant even take you seriously anymore when it comes to Redman... you're a smart guy, but you have an RDS style when it comes to redman...

2012
turner 3.6
redman 3.7

i dont care about redman one way or the other... we dont have a feature capable back IMO.

If you don't care for him what does it matter if I say all the reasons I don't like him?

Michael turner lost a step for sure but guys come in a step slower and still produce a decent amount. He's not just a talentless fool. I'd take 3.6 and 10 TDs over 3.7 and 2 TDs any day. He must have been doing enough for their offense

I can't take anyone who likes redman seriously because he doesn't really bring anything to the table. His entire career is based off a handful of "tough runs" in the preseason.

I do kinda think the steelers at least bring turner in for a work out, they brought beanie in and didn't like it, they brought Bradshaw in and thought about. Turner is at least worth a look.

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 12:23 AM
If you don't care for him what does it matter if I say all the reasons I don't like him?

Michael turner lost a step for sure but guys come in a step slower and still produce a decent amount. He's not just a talentless fool. I'd take 3.6 and 10 TDs over 3.7 and 2 TDs any day. He must have been doing enough for their offense

I can't take anyone who likes redman seriously because he doesn't really bring anything to the table. His entire career is based off a handful of "tough runs" in the preseason.

I do kinda think the steelers at least bring turner in for a work out, they brought beanie in and didn't like it, they brought Bradshaw in and thought about. Turner is at least worth a look.

those 10 TDs are the product of being the red zone back in a dangerous offense, behind a more capable offensive line.

Redman's entire career is based on being able to convert short yardage situations, and being a difficult to tackle bowling ball who always gains yards after contact.

he's dropped weight... he's also more elusive than you give him credit for... creating 28 missed tackles last year... that's an impressive number for a "no talent" guy.

to put that number in context, Adrian Peterson led the league with 64 missed tackles.... on 348 carries... Redman had 28 on 110 carries

Redman's 3.02 yards after contact was 7th IN THE LEAGUE (among backs that had at least 25% of their teams touches).

You ever look at PFFs Elusiveness Rating? it divides missed tackles by touches and multiplies that by yards after contact per attempt, and multiplies by 100 to get a more workable figure.

At the end of the season, Redman was second only to Buffalo Bills running back C.J. Spiller in the Elusiveness Rating. Spiller’s rating was 94.6, and Redman’s was 89.6. Bernard Pierce of the Baltimore Ravens was a distant third with a rating of 75.7, followed by Peterson at 72 and Jacquizz Rodgers at 61.1

Redman is a good, solid, NFL back. He's not a workhorse back. He's not a franchise back. But he's better than the scrub you portray him as, he's better than washed up broken body 30 yr old backs, and he's best healthy back on the roster right now.

you have an emotional opinion unsupported by anything tangible with context... you should get your eyes checked, or at least remove your emotional bias to come to a clearer conclusion... or at least vet your bias through data and maybe reevaluate

K Train
08-22-2013, 08:37 AM
those 10 TDs are the product of being the red zone back in a dangerous offense, behind a more capable offensive line.

Redman's entire career is based on being able to convert short yardage situations, and being a difficult to tackle bowling ball who always gains yards after contact.

he's dropped weight... he's also more elusive than you give him credit for... creating 28 missed tackles last year... that's an impressive number for a "no talent" guy.

to put that number in context, Adrian Peterson led the league with 64 missed tackles.... on 348 carries... Redman had 28 on 110 carries

Redman's 3.02 yards after contact was 7th IN THE LEAGUE (among backs that had at least 25% of their teams touches).

You ever look at PFFs Elusiveness Rating? it divides missed tackles by touches and multiplies that by yards after contact per attempt, and multiplies by 100 to get a more workable figure.

At the end of the season, Redman was second only to Buffalo Bills running back C.J. Spiller in the Elusiveness Rating. Spiller’s rating was 94.6, and Redman’s was 89.6. Bernard Pierce of the Baltimore Ravens was a distant third with a rating of 75.7, followed by Peterson at 72 and Jacquizz Rodgers at 61.1

Redman is a good, solid, NFL back. He's not a workhorse back. He's not a franchise back. But he's better than the scrub you portray him as, he's better than washed up broken body 30 yr old backs, and he's best healthy back on the roster right now.

you have an emotional opinion unsupported by anything tangible with context... you should get your eyes checked, or at least remove your emotional bias to come to a clearer conclusion... or at least vet your bias through data and maybe reevaluate
Thats fine the circumstances that turner had, at least he performed in the situation he was given. Its not like they would just throw until they got in the 5 yard line and give it to turner, actually they threw a TON in the redzone.

His 3 yards after contact isnt that good when its being stood up in the backfield and makes it back to the LOS and maybe gains one. You are always emotional in using PFF like its gods gift to football nerds, try to justify obscure stats all you want but the team obviously doesnt have faith in redman and this will become more clear when they do start to bring in older backs for looks. If you think he has a good "elusiveness rating" by watching him then maybe you are the one that needs to get your eyes checked because you cant just listen to whatever PFF has to say and that be good enough.

I dont get how my examples of him being painfully slow, not being the beast short yardsage and goal back hes built up to be, and the team not trusting him to be the guy isnt tangible, but his "elusiveness rating" on PFF might as well put the nail in the coffin of the argument? You are better than that.

When it all boils down redman is not productive, production is all that matters and when we need him to produce he comes up short.

Dwyer has always been better than redman, dwyer has been a **** head and 30 pounds overweight his whole career...based on how they are now if they have to choose between either one they will choose dwyer, who isnt a workhorse or franchise back either but hes better than redman.

I think they will bring in turner for a look personally, i dont really care either way, i just think its worth a shot.

Just because i hated redman since day one doesnt mean i have zero confirmation that he is a nobody, you can step down from your high and mighty "im so subjective because i form more complex opinions than you due to my studies of profootballfocuses list of obscure statistics", he doesnt produce, even when he was the starter, even when he was healthy, this should be clear to everyone.

If they dont bring someone in we are all going to miss bell before we even know if hes worth a damn or if hes the tony hunt caliber player i originally saw him as, at least it was exciting to think they could be a viable run game

LatrobePA
08-22-2013, 08:58 AM
We are trying to use practice squad RB's as starters. It's that simple!

Real Deal Steel
08-22-2013, 09:10 AM
Dwyer has dropped his weight and looks in good shape. He's going to get first crack.

I love Redman but he's just "a guy" and always has been. He's a soldier for sure but low on the talent scale.

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 09:42 AM
His 3 yards after contact isnt that good when its being stood up in the backfield and makes it back to the LOS and maybe gains one.

It's actually more impressive in that context... your example shows an ability to overcome a god awful offensive line (which is what we had last year)


You are always emotional in using PFF like its gods gift to football nerds, try to justify obscure stats all you want but the team obviously doesnt have faith in redman and this will become more clear when they do start to bring in older backs for looks. If you think he has a good "elusiveness rating" by watching him then maybe you are the one that needs to get your eyes checked because you cant just listen to whatever PFF has to say and that be good enough.

Credible football analystics have value. Those who dismiss them when they don't conform to their own beliefs are simply to egotistical to allow their opinion to be supplemented.

The semantics of the term "elusive" is immaterial, the PFF term is simpyl a measurement of gaining yards when a defender is in position to make a tackle. It's not just speed and super cool juke moves.... it's vision and power, 2 things Redman HAS in his favor.

FYI 7 Analysts from PFF have been hired by NFL teams in the last 2 years.


I dont get how my examples of him being painfully slow, not being the beast short yardsage and goal back hes built up to be, and the team not trusting him to be the guy isnt tangible, but his "elusiveness rating" on PFF might as well put the nail in the coffin of the argument? You are better than that.

Redman is faster than Michael Turner...

AS far as the team not trusting him to be the guy? I don't know what you mean... He's still listed as the co-starter... and I bet he gets the start in the all important 3rd preseason game.

The elusiveness rating is simply a measurement of missed/broken tackles...


When it all boils down redman is not productive, production is all that matters and when we need him to produce he comes up short.

In 2011, he had 4.4 YPG.... and a 90% conversion rate in short yardage situations... calling him "not productive" is unsupportable in any way.


Dwyer has always been better than redman, dwyer has been a **** head and 30 pounds overweight his whole career...based on how they are now if they have to choose between either one they will choose dwyer, who isnt a workhorse or franchise back either but hes better than redman.

wrong... 2011... or is your measurement going to change with the argument? I thought production was all that mattered?



Just because i hated redman since day one doesnt mean i have zero confirmation that he is a nobody, you can step down from your high and mighty "im so subjective because i form more complex opinions than you due to my studies of profootballfocuses list of obscure statistics", he doesnt produce, even when he was the starter, even when he was healthy, this should be clear to everyone.

You hated him since day 1, confirms that your viewpoint is mostly confirmation bias

Correction, YOU are subjective.... your opinion is solely based on personal opinion

K Train
08-22-2013, 09:53 AM
I meant objective.

Redman is a completely forgettable player in the league, but i guess since 7 analysts have been hired that ranked him so greatly he'll have no problem finding a job when the steelers finally cut him. If he was so elusively great and powerful they would have offered him a contract by now and not tried to replace him with Bell

Dwyer does have more talent, he was lazy and overweight but im predicting he puts redman to shame this year, and really he out performed him last year as the most productive back...even when both were banged up.

Maybe the steelers bring in someone and then that will tell us, but i really dont think they are comfortable with what they have if bell is slated to miss more than 2 months. Im not a dwyer fan boy, but if i need to choose between them ill take dwyer every time

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 10:44 AM
I meant objective.

Redman is a completely forgettable player in the league, but i guess since 7 analysts have been hired that ranked him so greatly he'll have no problem finding a job when the steelers finally cut him. If he was so elusively great and powerful they would have offered him a contract by now and not tried to replace him with Bell

I'm not interested in generic labels that are emotionally based.

Do I think Redman is great? No
Do I think the Steelers should be happy that Redman is one of the better backs on the roster? No
Do I think Redman is a sought after commodity? No

But I do NOT think your analysis is even remotely in the sphere of respectable or objective on the matter (as you've already admitted to a bias)

You assessment of his ability is unsupported
Your view of other washed up backs as being better options is also unsupported

I'd rather have Redman start, than Dwyer... I think Dwyer can make some bigger plays, but in reality he only runs one play well (going to his right, off tackle without cutting back). He is terrible in between the tackles, and he's the worst open field runner I've seen on the Steelers since Chris Fu. Seriously in this preseason, he's had 3 or 4 open field runs where he could've turned it into a bigger gain, and instead ran himself into a tackle... i know you know what im talking about.



Dwyer does have more talent, he was lazy and overweight but im predicting he puts redman to shame this year, and really he out performed him last year as the most productive back...even when both were banged up.

I'll take that bet


Maybe the steelers bring in someone and then that will tell us, but i really dont think they are comfortable with what they have if bell is slated to miss more than 2 months. Im not a dwyer fan boy, but if i need to choose between them ill take dwyer every time

I don't think they will bring in anyone (at least not anyone with a name...)

PS I think its sad that one of the more informed members of this board constantly writes off in depth analysis by professionals (PFF) whenever it doesn't suit their opinion... A true student of the game would take that information and at least use it to question themselves

K Train
08-22-2013, 10:51 AM
I'm not interested in generic labels that are emotionally based.

Do I think Redman is great? No
Do I think the Steelers should be happy that Redman is one of the better backs on the roster? No
Do I think Redman is a sought after commodity? No

But I do NOT think your analysis is even remotely in the sphere of respectable or objective on the matter (as you've already admitted to a bias)

You assessment of his ability is unsupported
Your view of other washed up backs as being better options is also unsupported

I'd rather have Redman start, than Dwyer... I think Dwyer can make some bigger plays, but in reality he only runs one play well (going to his right, off tackle without cutting back). He is terrible in between the tackles, and he's the worst open field runner I've seen on the Steelers since Chris Fu. Seriously in this preseason, he's had 3 or 4 open field runs where he could've turned it into a bigger gain, and instead ran himself into a tackle... i know you know what im talking about.



I'll take that bet



I don't think they will bring in anyone (at least not anyone with a name...)
I think the new scheme fits dwyer much better than it does redman, and i do not think dwyer is ideal by any means.

Washed up backs can still contribute....Tomlinson shared time with Shonn Greene and was still the better player during his year in NY. Having a 30+ year old RB isnt ideal and it can flop (westbrook in SF), but it could provide a little stability

Id like to call the packers or niners about one of their guys or get Bell from detroit since they have bush and leshoure firmly ahead of him at this point, both stop gap solutions, but i think theyd bring in one of the old guys before they trade for a back

Im biased in the way i never saw him as the "next undrafted gem" he was billed up to be, and even everyone who was rah rah steeler smashmotuh football is back on the legs of issac redman have come around to see that. My biased was 2010, just like it was with hood, both players are well below average players and my opinions on them havent changed....if they were star players and key elements of the team i certainly wouldnt feel this way, even though my initial thoughts of them were very bad.

I dont still love sweed just because i loved him in 2008

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 10:59 AM
You know I'm a fan of joique bell.
I think poking around for a younger back is a good idea.

Tomlinson is a far different player than turner/mcgahee

Stats back up the Hood bias

Redman is average... Andre brown is average

K Train
08-22-2013, 11:11 AM
It appears Bryce Brown might be falling out of favor in philly, in favor of chris polk...which is weird, but i wouldnt hate it if they made a move for him.

Felix jones appears to be done, so they might not be willing to move brown

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 11:42 AM
It appears Bryce Brown might be falling out of favor in philly, in favor of chris polk...which is weird, but i wouldnt hate it if they made a move for him.

Felix jones appears to be done, so they might not be willing to move brown

Bryce Brown is the type of back that will drive you mad. Hhe tries to bounce everything outside... leading to busted runs 3 out of 4 times... and he fumbles... but he has that size/speed combo that makes you drool. he's just football dumb.

if he was coachable, he has limitless potential (he was the #1 ranked player coming out of college at one point... ahead of trent richardson).

I'd take a flyer on him...

K Train
08-22-2013, 12:12 PM
yeah hes got some ball security issues, but i do remember when he was a 5* guy out of HS

coldrolled
08-22-2013, 01:41 PM
That's what tomlin needs a rb who fumbles a lot.

Who was the RB that fumbled in the Broncos game and seattle then ran back for 105 yards.. ??? tomlin would love him.

That's was a bad fumble... Tomlin would bench that guy for weeks.

Almost as bad as the one Bettis had in the Indy game.

But only Dwyers fumbles.. oh and Mendy, oh and Peterson, oh and Bettis, oh and......

K Train
08-22-2013, 01:50 PM
none of those guys fumble "alot"

Bryce has some things to work on, but its a correctable issue

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 02:22 PM
none of those guys fumble "alot"

Bryce has some things to work on, but its a correctable issue

Bryce Brown was 2nd in the league in fumbles per touch among RBs with at least 100 touches (4 on 128 touches)... by definition, he fumbles a lot (only Fred Jackson was worse with 5 on 149 touches... 5 was the most fumbles by any back)

K Train
08-22-2013, 02:40 PM
i meant dwyer, mendenhall, bettis

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 02:42 PM
i meant dwyer, mendenhall, bettis

my bad

TarlsQtr
08-22-2013, 03:17 PM
Bettis was one of the best ball security guys of all time. He averaged something like 3.15 fumbles per season. It is silly to include him on such a list because of one inopportune fumble where Brackett got a helmet on the ball.

coldrolled
08-22-2013, 03:20 PM
Bettis was one of the best ball security guys of all time. He averaged something like 3.15 fumbles per season. It is silly to include him on such a list because of one inopportune fumble where Brackett got a helmet on the ball.

My Sarcasm List... Our guys do not fumble that often... But the stink about one is unreal...

TarlsQtr
08-22-2013, 03:25 PM
My Sarcasm List... Our guys do not fumble that often... But the stink about one is unreal...

Gotcha. :-)

Real Deal Steel
08-22-2013, 03:58 PM
Leshore from Detroit isn't a bad call.

NeilPatrickBanana
08-22-2013, 04:01 PM
Leshore from Detroit isn't a bad call.

Detroit has no reason to move him

LevonKirkland99
08-22-2013, 08:29 PM
Another season and another stable of RBs that are merely above average...Why not Lacey instead of LeVeon?

LatrobePA
08-23-2013, 07:48 AM
Another season and another stable of RBs that are merely above average...Why not Lacey instead of LeVeon?

I don't question their draft but more of their lack of FA shopping.. There were good running backs to be had for cheap!! Red, Dwyer aren't scaring anyone!

K Train
08-23-2013, 08:13 AM
Another season and another stable of RBs that are merely above average...Why not Lacey instead of LeVeon?

i dont know where lacy become this world beating RB

Real Deal Steel
08-23-2013, 08:44 AM
I don't question their draft but more of their lack of FA shopping.. There were good running backs to be had for cheap!! Red, Dwyer aren't scaring anyone!

There was a window when Deangelo Williams was available. That intrigued me.

K Train
08-23-2013, 08:59 AM
i would have rather had lattimore if we had to wait a year to see our rookie RB lol

Big T
08-23-2013, 09:05 AM
i would have rather had lattimore if we had to wait a year to see our rookie RB lol

Lattimore :(

NeilPatrickBanana
08-23-2013, 09:17 AM
i would have rather had lattimore if we had to wait a year to see our rookie RB lol

Well played lol

Real Deal Steel
08-23-2013, 12:25 PM
i would have rather had lattimore if we had to wait a year to see our rookie RB lol

So what are we? A place where fragile runningbacks go to die? Lattimore, Felix Jones, gzzzzzzzzzz

cmerrifield
08-24-2013, 11:31 AM
Where are the Lacy lovers now?

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