PDA

View Full Version : Ryan Clark's tweet about Ben Roethlisberger and Ray Lewis



BlitzburghRockCity
01-04-2013, 10:20 AM
People are up in arms about it for some reason. It's not like Clark has been afraid to speak his mind in the past no matter who the subject is about. We seem to forget that a lot of these players are friends off the field, and have respect for each other regardless of how much the fans hate each other.

ryan clark ‏ @ RealRClark25 (https://twitter.com/RealRClark25)
It's sad that all the Steeler fans who get upset when people speak on Ben's situation continually bring up Ray Lewis' case. # glasshouse (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23glasshouse&src=hash)

BlitzburghRockCity
01-04-2013, 10:22 AM
My only gripe is that Clark fails to mention that how many Ravens fans speak of Ben and call him Rapisburger and all that dumb ****. Seriously Ryan, if you're going to call out one, at least call out both and be done with it. He honestly doesn't care though one way or the other but fans sure love to take this stuff and run with it.

Big T
01-04-2013, 10:31 AM
He's right though

jpele
01-04-2013, 10:35 AM
he also fails to mention Ben was only accused while Ray was actually convicted.

USMC607
01-04-2013, 11:02 AM
^True Story.

Crash
01-04-2013, 11:17 AM
He's a pea-brain. What pisses fans off the most is how media outlets CONTINUE, to this day, mention Ben's issues but those same outlets treat Ray Lewis like a hero.

He had no business, to defend an accused murderer ex-con like Ray Lewis, at the expense of his own uncharged teammate.

But then again, this clown was in the Ravens locker room hamming it up with Ed Reed AFTER they beat us in Pittsburgh.

Speeed
01-04-2013, 11:52 AM
Nothing wrong with having fun. They are childhood friends. And most players are friends and leave rivalries on the field. Unlike too many fans. I thought it was funny.

As for Clark's comment, it is true. But unnecessary that is for sure. Living near Baltimore I can say that people seem to be forgetful of his guilt. I don't know the guy, but my feeling is he was involved in more ways than he admits to. He wants to be a minister. Yeah, right. One guy said he should run for mayor - he would get 100 percent of the vote. I bet he would, that is how stupid (and corrupt) the city is. He would fit right in. I think media holds athletes of different backgrounds to different standards. When athlete associates himself with one kind of person and life style and group of friends they can get a pass. When somebody has a seemingly wholesome lifestyle with a family background, and they get into trouble, guess what? That will live with them the rest of their life.

I am sure that many in Pittsburgh overlook Ben's transgressions as well. Regardless, he will always have that "*" by his name. Whereas Ray will not, despite being found guilty. I would not be surprised if Ben does not get into the hall of fame and his past is a huge part of the debate either way and Ray gets in without a word of his "incident."

I guess it is all in your perspective.


He's a pea-brain. What pisses fans off the most is how media outlets CONTINUE, to this day, mention Ben's issues but those same outlets treat Ray Lewis like a hero.

He had no business, to defend an accused murderer ex-con like Ray Lewis, at the expense of his own uncharged teammate.

But then again, this clown was in the Ravens locker room hamming it up with Ed Reed AFTER they beat us in Pittsburgh.

Crash
01-04-2013, 12:53 PM
LT and Michael Irvin are in the Hall.

If they try to keep Ben out? Then Ray Lewis out too.

Or, if Lewis does get in, maybe he'll wear the white suit he wore the night of the murders that's been missing for 13 years.

Crash
01-04-2013, 12:54 PM
Why didn't Clark mention Charlie Batch then?

We know why, you just can't say why.

SuperSteelers
01-04-2013, 01:11 PM
Ryan Clark is a flaming idiot.

jdehoff83
01-04-2013, 01:57 PM
What did batch do?

Crash
01-04-2013, 02:49 PM
While with the Lions accused of kidnapping and gang rape in Vegas with three other players.

Sued just like Ben.

Batch was scheduled to go to trial, then she was paid off.

Real Deal Steel
01-04-2013, 03:01 PM
I'm tired of Clark and his mouth. He needs to shut up.

elephantman
01-04-2013, 04:07 PM
LT and Michael Irvin are in the Hall.

If they try to keep Ben out? Then Ray Lewis out too.

Or, if Lewis does get in, maybe he'll wear the white suit he wore the night of the murders that's been missing for 13 years.

Lol dont put Ben and Ray in same sentence. Ray is proly top 15 players ALL TIME, Ben is about the 15th Best QB Right Now. If Ben Retired today his HOF would be questionable when u consider his body of work...he isnt near LT, Ray, or Irvin. Had Ray retired 7 yrs ago he still gets in

btw, are we suggesting Ray pullled the trigger//???

I think Ray is genuinly a Good person today, as for his past, hey when your from the ghetto, it aint easy getttin out.

JShare86
01-04-2013, 04:13 PM
Lol dont put Ben and Ray in same sentence. Ray is proly top 15 players ALL TIME, Ben is about the 15th Best QB Right Now. If Ben Retired today his HOF would be questionable when u consider his body of work...he isnt near LT, Ray, or Irvin. Had Ray retired 7 yrs ago he still gets in

btw, are we suggesting Ray pullled the trigger//???

I think Ray is genuinly a Good person today, as for his past, hey when your from the ghetto, it aint easy getttin out.

Great post I agree with everything except Ben being 15th best right now. I'd put him somewhere from 6-9

Crash
01-04-2013, 04:25 PM
Ben is in the HOF. History says he's in.

He has three AFC titles. EVERY ELIGIBLE QB, regardless of SB record (like 2-1 Bob Griese, and 0-3 Fran Tarkenton) who has started three Super Bowls, is in the HOF.

Get7With7
01-04-2013, 04:31 PM
I wonder what the response in Steeler Nation would've been if Clark brought up Ward's DUI, or the fact that Harrison hit his wife?

connecticutsteel
01-04-2013, 04:52 PM
he also fails to mention Ben was only accused while Ray was actually convicted.

Lewis was charged but not convicted of murder he pled out to a lesser charge

ChucktownSteeler
01-05-2013, 01:30 PM
Ray Lewis killed a person.

No comparison, end of story.

JShare86
01-05-2013, 02:07 PM
Ray Lewis killed a person.

No comparison, end of story.

No he didn't

Zachintosh66
01-05-2013, 02:25 PM
both ray and ben situations... tired of hearing about both.

LatrobePA
01-05-2013, 02:29 PM
both ray and ben situations... tired of hearing about both.

Right! Ray stabbed someone with a knife and well um we know what Ben used to stab someone! Time to move on!!

Speeed
01-05-2013, 04:02 PM
We don't know for sure. Not that it matters, this is what I think . . . .

He went out with persons of questionable character, of which he was fully aware. He went to a club that has more than a normal potential for trouble. He went there to flash money, act cool, and strut a bit with his crew. Somebody ran their mouth, him and his crew took exception. So, a fight ensues. A knife comes out. Somebody was killed. I don't think Ray actually stabbed the guy, but he was involved. My bet is he was part of the physical confrontation, but was not expecting somebody to pull a knife (but should he be surprised? Duh...) and get killed.

That at least makes him an accessory to murder or manslaughter. Especially after his coverup and efforts to impede the investigation. If so, he got off lightly. That is just my guess at what happened. If that had happened at 1 pm in front of a Cracker Barrel the police would have gotten to the bottom of that in about 10 minutes. And my guess is Ray would still be doing some time.

So, that raises the questions, guilty of more than obstruction of justice or not, do potential HOF candidates get get passed over, or not even nominated, due to their past? Arrest record? Is the HOF a measure of character, career accomplishments, or both? Do "allegations" count? Even when not really investigated by the police?

I think the HOF committee needs to make some sort of statement regarding the character standards either way of candidates. That might clean things up a bit. We all know that Payton Manning boy is out of control!


Ray Lewis killed a person.

No comparison, end of story.

Crash
01-05-2013, 04:16 PM
Well this certainly explains the Ben suspension and the fact that his 4th missed game was the Ravens in Pittsburgh.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8812228/roger-goodell-lauds-baltimore-ravens-retiring-ray-lewis-special-guy

LevonKirkland99
01-05-2013, 04:54 PM
Ryan Clark is free to speak his mind, but that was a dumb tweet. I thought Clark was above this stuff. Ben and Lewis are no saints, but let the fans debate that.

LatrobePA
01-05-2013, 06:31 PM
Twitter is fn stupid!

LevonKirkland99
01-05-2013, 08:13 PM
Twitter is fn stupid!

Sure is....this is a guy who went to the emergency after the Cleveland game! Stay cool Clatk

Ravenous Rex
01-06-2013, 11:06 PM
he also fails to mention Ben was only accused while Ray was actually convicted.

So tired and old. Can u please get a clue. Yeah, ray Lewis was convicted of obstruction of justice which was done voluntarily and helped the Atlanta police department n ave face for wrongly accusing him to begin with. Ryan Clark is finally another steeler I respect because he isn't afraid to speak the truth.

Ray wasn't involved in anything other than some thugs picking a fight w members of his possee at the time. He was hiking and dumb and surrounded by friends who didnt haw his best interests in kind and he took the fall because of who he was period. There wasn't anyone else in the bathroom with that girl. Just Ben. But u go ahead and hide behind semantics and "cases being dropped." Yeah, because money and power didn't have anything to do with that.

Hypocritical and ignorant... And old...

scudmissile29
01-06-2013, 11:07 PM
So tired and old. Can u please get a clue. Yeah, ray Lewis was convicted of obstruction of justice which was done voluntarily and helped the Atlanta police department n ave face for wrongly accusing him to begin with. Ryan Clark is finally another steeler I respect because he isn't afraid to speak the truth.

Ray wasn't involved in anything other than some thugs picking a fight w members of his possee at the time. He was hiking and dumb and surrounded by friends who didnt haw his best interests in kind and he took the fall because of who he was period. There wasn't anyone else in the bathroom with that girl. Just Ben. But u go ahead and hide behind semantics and "cases being dropped." Yeah, because money and power didn't have anything to do with that.

Hypocritical and ignorant... And old...

Oh do shut up.

At a quick opportunity, tie some rope around your neck and jump off a bridge, ****ing ratbird scum.

Crash
01-06-2013, 11:12 PM
Why did the limo driver change his story?

Why has Ray the Knife's suit still missing?

NYCsteelersfan
01-07-2013, 01:49 AM
he also fails to mention Ben was only accused while Ray was actually convicted.

So do more than half of idiot football fans who are too stupid to know the difference between an accusation, an arrest, an indictment, and a conviction.


Why didn't Clark mention Charlie Batch then?

We know why, you just can't say why.

Who's "you"? I'll say it. Clark, a black player, threw his white teammate under the bus in order to stick up for his black friend on a rival team. I expect nothing less from players on this team under Tomlin.

steelcityrockers
01-07-2013, 12:41 PM
Who's "you"? I'll say it. Clark, a black player, threw his white teammate under the bus in order to stick up for his black friend on a rival team. I expect nothing less from players on this team under Tomlin.

You'd probably be wise to backtrack immediately. Most places, blatant racism is cause for an immediate ban. Now, I have no idea of the type of people/mods around these parts, but **** like this getting posted without any type of action doesn't speak much for the crowd here.

Speeed
01-07-2013, 12:43 PM
Yes he is guilty. Of at least accessory to murder. My hunch is he was involved in a fight but got more than he asked for when one of his "posse" pulled out a knife. I am sure Ray was not expecting that (he should not be surprised considering the crew he was with) and things went wrong. If he was not involved in the confrontation then guess what, he is guilty of helping murderers escaping the scene of a crime. In a limo I bet he payed for. And helping them cover things up.

I believe his charge was "Obstruction of Justice." He basically lied to the police to cover up the incident. There is more to this story than Ray is going to tell us. Maybe less than what some people believe too. I really don't care either way, I am just saying he has nothing to gain by telling us what really happened. We still don't really know.


So tired and old. Can u please get a clue. Yeah, ray Lewis was convicted of obstruction of justice which was done voluntarily and helped the Atlanta police department n ave face for wrongly accusing him to begin with. Ryan Clark is finally another steeler I respect because he isn't afraid to speak the truth.

Ray wasn't involved in anything other than some thugs picking a fight w members of his possee at the time. He was hiking and dumb and surrounded by friends who didnt haw his best interests in kind and he took the fall because of who he was period. There wasn't anyone else in the bathroom with that girl. Just Ben. But u go ahead and hide behind semantics and "cases being dropped." Yeah, because money and power didn't have anything to do with that.

Hypocritical and ignorant... And old...

Speeed
01-07-2013, 01:35 PM
Blatant? In fact, He did not say anything racist. Maybe he is black? He accused Clark of being racist. Anytime people talk about race this crap happens. Ridiculous. Talk of banning, finger pointing, etc. Did you read his post? It seems to me he did kinda' dis Ben. He did defend Ray. Ben is white. Lewis is black. So what? If he did do that based on race is Clark a racist? I personally don't think Lewis, Ben, or NYC Steelersfan is racist. Just my opinion.




You'd probably be wise to backtrack immediately. Most places, blatant racism is cause for an immediate ban. Now, I have no idea of the type of people/mods around these parts, but **** like this getting posted without any type of action doesn't speak much for the crowd here.

Rhyno
01-07-2013, 04:16 PM
Clark, a black player, threw his white teammate under the bus in order to stick up for his black friend on a rival team. I expect nothing less from players on this team under Tomlin.

This statement is, without a doubt, 100 percent full-retard.

NYCsteelersfan
01-07-2013, 09:07 PM
You'd probably be wise to backtrack immediately. Most places, blatant racism is cause for an immediate ban. Now, I have no idea of the type of people/mods around these parts, but **** like this getting posted without any type of action doesn't speak much for the crowd here.

Luckily for everyone on this forum, the mods know how to read unlike yourself. It's never too late to learn to read.


Blatant? In fact, He did not say anything racist. Maybe he is black? He accused Clark of being racist. Anytime people talk about race this crap happens. Ridiculous. Talk of banning, finger pointing, etc. Did you read his post? It seems to me he did kinda' dis Ben. He did defend Ray. Ben is white. Lewis is black. So what? If he did do that based on race is Clark a racist? I personally don't think Lewis, Ben, or NYC Steelersfan is racist. Just my opinion.

Lol...him calling it "blatant racism" was the best part. It was like he wanted to underline his blatant stupidity. Thanks for trying to respectfully reason with him, but when someone displays that level of stupidity, then it probably means they're an a$$hole or they are incapable of understanding reason.


This statement is, without a doubt, 100 percent full-retard For those who are intellectually disabled, that word is as offensive as any other racial slur.

Rhyno
01-07-2013, 10:26 PM
For those who are intellectually disabled, that word is as offensive as any other racial slur.

LOL. No, it's not. However, I should not have used it. I should have just said that bringing race into this discussion was mind-numbing.

DBR96A
01-07-2013, 11:17 PM
Ryan Clark's point is that Steeler fans live in glass houses; therefore they should not throw stones.

Clevelandsux
01-08-2013, 12:15 AM
Ive never looked past bens past. I like him as a football player, but not so much as a human being. If anything, Ben is guilty of being stupid. But I'm sick of ray ray getting a pass. Whether he physically killed anyone or not he i do believe he was at least an accomplice to murders. I watched the behind the lines on nfl network today on ray Lewis. His recollection of the event is nothing like what I'm reading on the net. He said was in a limo and it got hit by bullets and they drove off. Totally contrary to the reports I've read. Neither him or his buddies were convicted. Nor has anyone else. But seems like ray even paid for the defense of his buddies. While the families of the victims could hardly scrape up enough money to go to trail.

As far as Clark, he need to zip it. Don't callout your own fan base. And I'm sure race has a lot to do with his rants too.

RIVERS OF STEEL
01-08-2013, 12:20 AM
Tell me if anyone will remember who the hell ryan clark was when his career is over?

There are over a million steeler fans world wide I'm bettin. How many fans you got clark. Now, shut the fuk up and play football.

RIVERS OF STEEL
01-08-2013, 12:22 AM
Tell me if anyone will remember who the hell ryan clark was? If you add the ages of all steelers fans every where the total would be exponential. Add ryans clarks fans ages. maybe a couple hundred. So, what the fuk does he know about cabbage?

Clevelandsux
01-08-2013, 12:46 AM
I like Clark. He is a hardnosed player. But needs to zip it. You don't take on steelers nation. Ask rashard. And a lot of fools still defend o.j after he murdered his white wife. Big Ben was suspended 4 games for his accusations. Lewis was fined 250k but never suspended. Double standard there.

Speeed
01-08-2013, 09:12 AM
I agree. Derogatory remarks are derogatory remarks. What if I were retarded? Or a family member was retarded? That would be just as offensive as any racial slur. A slur is a slur. It gets back to that whole race issue. One need just accuse or mention "race" regardless of the validity of the statement, and people just get stupid. As evidenced in this, of all places, an NFL forum.

If someone accuses someone of being racist, or of making a derogatory or stereotyping comment, please make sure there is evidence. Most times it is just because people think, or feel there is substance to their claim. When in fact, there is not. As in this case. Sigh . . .



For those who are intellectually disabled, that word is as offensive as any other racial slur.

TarlsQtr
01-08-2013, 11:08 AM
I agree. Derogatory remarks are derogatory remarks. What if I were retarded? Or a family member was retarded? That would be just as offensive as any racial slur. A slur is a slur. It gets back to that whole race issue. One need just accuse or mention "race" regardless of the validity of the statement, and people just get stupid. As evidenced in this, of all places, an NFL forum.

I would say that someone does not offend us, we choose to be offended. PS, "mentally retarded" is a medical term that is still in use although it was obviously not used medically in this case.


If someone accuses someone of being racist, or of making a derogatory or stereotyping comment, please make sure there is evidence.

I agree with this statement but it could just as easily be used about NYCSteelersfan's comment. He implied that both Ryan's tweet and Tomlin's team culture were racist with no evidence. Has Ben complained about Ryan's tweet? Has he or any other white player claimed that Clark and Tomlin were racist? What is his evidence?

Real Deal Steel
01-08-2013, 11:17 AM
They need to draft a safety in the third round to send a little message to Mr. Clark. :lol:

Speeed
01-08-2013, 12:17 PM
I agree. Social media makes people stupid. I think most of us are guilty of that to some extent. I guess when you are celebrity of sorts you tend to think people really care what you think! Google, Facebook, Twitter, ad nausea are going to be the downfall of modern civilization!

I just read an NFL player Tweeted his phone number to the hotty Miss Alabama girlfriend of some college QB during a game. Stupidity FTW!

I just noticed I used a bunch of exclamation points (!). I had to go back to edit and state that.


I like Clark. He is a hardnosed player. But needs to zip it. You don't take on steelers nation. Ask rashard. And a lot of fools still defend o.j after he murdered his white wife. Big Ben was suspended 4 games for his accusations. Lewis was fined 250k but never suspended. Double standard there.

Crash
01-08-2013, 01:40 PM
Clark's a buffoon. He once berated the host of his own radio show, almost got into a fight with ESPN 970's Joe Bendal, and acted like an *** at a retirement party for a Steelers office staffer by berating other customers at Nakama in Pittsburgh.

His latest BS isn't a surprise at all.

steelchamp204
01-08-2013, 02:23 PM
Im tired of Clarks social media and off the field talking. Just shut up Ryan. Please.

LatrobePA
01-08-2013, 02:37 PM
Im tired of Clarks social media and off the field talking. Just shut up Ryan. Please.

I agree, for an average player he's talking too much! I hate that ****!

NYCsteelersfan
01-09-2013, 08:16 PM
PS, "mentally retarded" is a medical term that is still in use although it was obviously not used medically in this case.

I agree with this statement but it could just as easily be used about NYCSteelersfan's comment. He implied that both Ryan's tweet and Tomlin's team culture were racist with no evidence. Has Ben complained about Ryan's tweet? Has he or any other white player claimed that Clark and Tomlin were racist? What is his evidence?

Mentally retarded is not the same thing as "retard." And even mentally retarded as a medical term is being phased out in favor of intellectually disabled/challenged. At some point, "negro" was used officially to classify those of African origin before being replaced by African-(country of residence). I just find it interesting that many on these forums are quick to use an offensive word like "retard," but when someone says anything about black and white relations, especially someone who is not known to be black themselves, they're labeled a racist.

And I never implied that Clark's comment or Tomlin's team culture is racist. My statement was explicit and had nothing to do with racism. Racism means someone thinking they're race is superior to other races. I have no idea if Clark or Tomlin are racists, however, it's obvious that Clark's comment was clearly racially motivated.

Ask yourself: what was Clark's point? Pittsburgh fans shouldn't point to the criminality of opposing team's players because their own team has players who have some form of criminal past? First of all, if his point was that people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, then why not simply look up statistics for crimes committed in Pittsburgh and say something like "this many Pittsburgh residents committed this many crimes and yet Steeler fans point to Ray Lewis." That way, he directly points to the individuals actually casting the stones rather than using a teammate as counterpoint in defense of Ray Lewis. Second of all, if he wanted to make the specific point that Pittsburgh fans shouldn't talk about opposing team's players' criminal past because their own team has players with a criminal past, then why not point to Alemeda Ta'amu who was actually arrested? Or how about Joey Porter or Burress? Why Roethlisberger? To me, it's pretty obvious why he chose Roethlisberger because Clark's point was "white Steeler fans give white Roethlisberger a pass but always talk about black Ray Lewis being a murderer."

And what does this have to do with Tomlin? I said I expect nothing less because Tomlin has zero control over these players.

Real Deal Steel
01-09-2013, 09:13 PM
And that's the underlying problem to all the problems on this team....Tomlin is nothing but a front office extension down to the field. He's not a real coach.

NYCsteelersfan
01-11-2013, 04:04 PM
And that's the underlying problem to all the problems on this team....Tomlin is nothing but a front office extension down to the field. He's not a real coach.

Agreed.

LatrobePA
01-11-2013, 04:52 PM
From Harrison calling out Goodell to Clark running his mouth on twitter to Woodley coming in overweight and the list goes on.

Lets look at all the penalties this team had this year, Tomlin is a joke, the players don't give a ****..

DBR96A
01-11-2013, 05:29 PM
I guess shitting on Todd Haley and Ben Roethlisberger wasn't enough for some fans this off-season. Now we have to **** on Ryan Clark too, apparently. Anybody who really thinks that Clark is an average player is a below-average fan -- and the average fan is a goddamn moron as it is.

Seriously, get lives. You care about the players far more than they care about you. You're the people who read People. You call Roethlisberger a "drama queen" while getting bent out of shape about the most trivial **** yourselves. And if my comments offend you, then they're directed at you because you deserve it.

Speeed
01-11-2013, 05:32 PM
BAM!


I guess shitting on Todd Haley and Ben Roethlisberger wasn't enough for some fans this off-season. Now we have to **** on Ryan Clark too, apparently. Anybody who really thinks that Clark is an average player is a below-average fan -- and the average fan is a goddamn moron as it is.

Seriously, get lives. You care about the players far more than they care about you. You're the people who read People. You call Roethlisberger a "drama queen" while getting bent out of shape about the most trivial **** yourselves. And if my comments offend you, then they're directed at you because you deserve it.

Crash
01-11-2013, 05:34 PM
I guess shitting on Todd Haley and Ben Roethlisberger wasn't enough for some fans this off-season. Now we have to **** on Ryan Clark too, apparently. Anybody who really thinks that Clark is an average player is a below-average fan -- and the average fan is a goddamn moron as it is.

Seriously, get lives. You care about the players far more than they care about you. You're the people who read People. You call Roethlisberger a "drama queen" while getting bent out of shape about the most trivial **** yourselves. And if my comments offend you, then they're directed at you because you deserve it.

Clark had an excellent year on the field. Probbaly the best since he's been here.

But he's still a jackass off of it.

LatrobePA
01-11-2013, 05:58 PM
Ryan Clark was an above average player before Goodell put in the new rules, after that he became and average at best player... Goodell won that battle! Kinda like the Hines Ward rule!!

NYCsteelersfan
01-12-2013, 03:59 AM
I guess shitting on Todd Haley and Ben Roethlisberger wasn't enough for some fans this off-season. Now we have to **** on Ryan Clark too, apparently. Anybody who really thinks that Clark is an average player is a below-average fan -- and the average fan is a goddamn moron as it is.

Seriously, get lives. You care about the players far more than they care about you. You're the people who read People. You call Roethlisberger a "drama queen" while getting bent out of shape about the most trivial **** yourselves. And if my comments offend you, then they're directed at you because you deserve it.

Clark didn't just criticize the fan base, which would be trivial. He basically said, "fans that pay my salary, you shouldn't scrutinize a player from our rival team for supposedly getting away with murder because the star quarterback on OUR team supposedly got away with rape." If you think a defensive player throwing his own teammate under the bus in defense of Ray Lewis of all people is trivial, then you have no clue what trivial means. And telling people on a sports forum that you're a member of to get lives is actually really funny.

Crash
01-12-2013, 01:43 PM
Yep, that's the issue. He had no business bringing Ben into this.