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RIVERS OF STEEL
01-01-2013, 02:04 PM
Crazy but, probably impossible to get wise back. Just a reminder, he did help get the 2005 SB win and he also sent the cards to the SB. Anyone think he would be better than Haley (pretty easy one here. IMO).

cbrunn
01-01-2013, 02:09 PM
You got to give Haley more then one year ... players got to learn the system better and everything else ...

you don't want to start being like the teams that are always out of the playoffs , switching coaches every year and never give your players time to learn...

Stability is one of the biggest reasons the Steelers are always good

LatrobePA
01-01-2013, 02:33 PM
He'll be in Dallas..

Big T
01-01-2013, 02:39 PM
You got to give Haley more then one year ... players got to learn the system better and everything else ...

you don't want to start being like the teams that are always out of the playoffs , switching coaches every year and never give your players time to learn...

Stability is one of the biggest reasons the Steelers are always good

Exactly. Did anyone really believe Haley would come in and this team would have a top 5 offense right away? It takes time. I had a ton of optimism when he was hired and based on the pre-Ben injury play calling, I still do. I really do believe that given more time, and a healthy offense, it will improve.

Raleigh Steel
01-01-2013, 03:00 PM
Would whiz really come back to a place where he was passed over for the head job and work for the guy who was hired instead of him? Highly doubt it.

Face it, unless Haley is hired as a HC somewhere he's our OC next year, so there should be no need to continue these posts.

RIVERS OF STEEL
01-01-2013, 03:06 PM
Damn, I keep forgetting Haley is the greatest thing since sliced bread around here. Oh well. I do doubt Whiz is ever going to be a player around here though. Can't wait till 2013.

HUNT4SEVEN
01-01-2013, 03:18 PM
I would love to have Russ Grimm and Crennel as my OL coach and D Coordinator

LatrobePA
01-01-2013, 03:36 PM
Damn, I keep forgetting Haley is the greatest thing since sliced bread around here. Oh well. I do doubt Whiz is ever going to be a player around here though. Can't wait till 2013.

Haley, Ben, Troy, Tomlin are all the best since sliced bread, even when they admit to playing bad/ coaching bad people out here will defend them! lol

Nolrog
01-01-2013, 04:21 PM
Damn, I keep forgetting Haley is the greatest thing since sliced bread around here. Oh well. I do doubt Whiz is ever going to be a player around here though. Can't wait till 2013.

Damn, I keep forgetting Haley is the biggest piece of s**t in world history around here. Oh well . . .

Nolrog
01-01-2013, 04:24 PM
Haley, Ben, Troy, Tomlin are all the best since sliced bread, even when they admit to playing bad/ coaching bad people out here will defend them! lol

And even when they play well / coach well people out here will crap on them.

LatrobePA
01-01-2013, 04:25 PM
Lol us fans are dicks!

Crash
01-01-2013, 04:27 PM
Exactly. Did anyone really believe Haley would come in and this team would have a top 5 offense right away?

We will never have a top 5 offense. Our insistence on running the ball with late leads prevent it.

Same with scoring. Unless we start forcing more turnovers, the best we will peak at is between 12-15.

Crash
01-01-2013, 04:28 PM
Haley's incompetent. His play-calling in key moments of the Bengals game cemented his legacy.

Nolrog
01-01-2013, 04:37 PM
Haley's incompetent. His play-calling in key moments of the Bengals game cemented his legacy.

One year is a legacy? One game cemented that? You need to take a step back from your Haley Hatred and look at things with some objectivity.

coldrolled
01-01-2013, 04:56 PM
Damn, I keep forgetting Haley is the greatest thing since sliced bread around here. Oh well. I do doubt Whiz is ever going to be a player around here though. Can't wait till 2013.

Wasnt the Cards offense cruising with Whiz HC and Haley OC?

SteelCityKid5
01-01-2013, 05:01 PM
Im giving Haley more than one freakin year.

Crash
01-01-2013, 05:01 PM
One year is a legacy? One game cemented that? You need to take a step back from your Haley Hatred and look at things with some objectivity.

Yeah, 8 and 8. Turned a franchise QB into Trent Dilfer and our BACKUP running back had a higher yards per catch than Antonio Brown.

Ben had a new offense in 2007 with his new OC, completely new system and new terminology.

He threw 32 TD passes and Parker was leading the league in rushing.

Hold Haley to the same standards, don't let the Pittsburgh guy off the hook.

Crash
01-01-2013, 05:02 PM
Wasnt the Cards offense cruising with Whiz HC and Haley OC?

We don't run that offense. That featured 3 wides and three 1000 yard receivers.

This is Art's offense, what he wants, and Haley is doing it for him.

Puppet's gotta eat too.

Zachintosh66
01-01-2013, 05:30 PM
yeah yeah we get it... you dont like Haley. But hes not leaving, can we move on now?

steelchamp204
01-01-2013, 05:31 PM
Yeah, 8 and 8. Turned a franchise QB into Trent Dilfer and our BACKUP running back had a higher yards per catch than Antonio Brown.

Ben had a new offense in 2007 with his new OC, completely new system and new terminology.

He threw 32 TD passes and Parker was leading the league in rushing.

Hold Haley to the same standards, don't let the Pittsburgh guy off the hook.

Ben was having a MVP type season before he got injured, noone was calling out for Haley's head until Ben came back and the debacle happened. It was obvious Ben was not healhty for the last portion of the year. AN MVP TYP ESEASON BEFORE THE INJURY. Now all of a sudden we want to be the Browns?Raiders and other **** teams who get rid of cordinators after 1 season? Are you ****ing kidding me. You do realize our offensive line was in shambles this season after Adams went down also?

I think it's funny how everyone put the blame on Haley when Ben never had time to do anything with the ball anyway the last half of the season.

He needs 3 years, give him 2 more years. Next year will be different.

Crash
01-01-2013, 05:50 PM
Ben was having a MVP type season before he got injured, noone was calling out for Haley's head until Ben came back and the debacle happened. It was obvious Ben was not healhty for the last portion of the year

Bullshit. Two things changed when Ben came back.

1. 3rd down Ben wasn't saving Haley's *** anymore like he did earlier in the year. Before I started posting here, on other forums (I use the same user name) I said all year the offense trying to rely on 3rd down Ben was a disaster waiting to happen.

2. Starting with the Chiefs game teams began cheating up, playing press coverage, and taking away the short routes. Did we adjust? Did we start throwing deeper passes? No. See that pick against Cincy? The minute we went to two wides and two TEs the Bengals had Leon Hall (Their best corner) shadow Heath, he knew where we were throwing before Ben threw the pass.

Ben's arm isn't an issue. See that 60 yard bomb to Wallace? See that bomb to Brown Sunday?

The play-calling is too F'N predictable, and has been all season. If this doesn't improve? Barring Ben saving Haley's *** on 3rd down all season? 8-8 seasons will continue.

The NAME of the OC does not matter if he's nothing but a Rooney puppet.

Crash
01-01-2013, 06:01 PM
Just wonderful Andy Reid is the leading candidate for the Cards job. Looks like we are stuck with Lee Trevino for at least another year.

steelchamp204
01-01-2013, 06:09 PM
Bullshit. Two things changed when Ben came back.

1. 3rd down Ben wasn't saving Haley's *** anymore like he did earlier in the year. Before I started posting here, on other forums (I use the same user name) I said all year the offense trying to rely on 3rd down Ben was a disaster waiting to happen.

2. Starting with the Chiefs game teams began cheating up, playing press coverage, and taking away the short routes. Did we adjust? Did we start throwing deeper passes? No. See that pick against Cincy? The minute we went to two wides and two TEs the Bengals had Leon Hall (Their best corner) shadow Heath, he knew where we were throwing before Ben threw the pass.

Ben's arm isn't an issue. See that 60 yard bomb to Wallace? See that bomb to Brown Sunday?

The play-calling is too F'N predictable, and has been all season. If this doesn't improve? Barring Ben saving Haley's *** on 3rd down all season? 8-8 seasons will continue.

The NAME of the OC does not matter if he's nothing but a Rooney puppet.

I really believe you're a delusional troll. So Ben was saving Haley's *** earlier this season, so when the debacle happened, Ben didnt save haley(due to poor decisions by Ben) Yet it was still Haley's fault. Wow.

So when did Ben have enough time this season to actually throw the ball deep? How many times this season did we see Ben throw a pretty unaccurate deep ball? Yet, that is Haley's fault.

Also, no **** it's not Bens arm thats the issue, if you ever strained your chest, pulled a muscle in your chest, it effects your strength in your throwing motion. Ben didnt have the zip on the ball towards the end of the season, did you see that? Or are you just reading the papers and watching SC?

Your logic on this site is ****, you're going after Rooney? Seriously, the guy pays the god damn players. If he wants to see more run than so be it. The Steelers are all of a sudden pressured due to the fact that this league is a pass happy league? You talk about running the ball to much when we have a lead in the 4th quarter, did you also bitch when Cowher did the same thing? Look up Cowhers record once and see what his win loss ratio was when going into the 4th quarter with a lead.

Something you need to practice is patience, if you cant accept a 8-8 season and go off on the ledge and call for Ben to be traded/Rooney to stfu/Haley to be fired, then Id like to see how you would have handled a 4-12 season or 5-11. This team will miss the playoffs, they're not going to the sb every single season.

Haley being a 1st year OC here in pitt can be graded atleast a B. Now you want him gone? So, if we hired another OC this season, lets say Whiz, he goes 9-7 and we still miss the playoffs, averaged 21 ppg. Would you want him gone? Maybe you should just be a raiders fan.

Get7With7
01-01-2013, 07:37 PM
I really believe you're a delusional troll. So Ben was saving Haley's *** earlier this season, so when the debacle happened, Ben didnt save haley(due to poor decisions by Ben) Yet it was still Haley's fault. Wow.

The play calling at times this season was too predictable. Run, run, pass clearly wasn't working, but it's what the Steelers wanted to do because they were obsessed with time of possession. Ben was put in too many 3rd & long situations, and the fact that he was able to bail the team out as often as he did before the injury shows how good of a QB he is. Next year, the Steelers should not tempt fate so often.




And how many times before this season have we seen Ben throw many accurate deep passes? Perhaps not throwing them as often results in a lack of chemistry between him and the WRs when going deep.

[QUOTE]Also, no **** it's not Bens arm thats the issue, if you ever strained your chest, pulled a muscle in your chest, it effects your strength in your throwing motion. Ben didnt have the zip on the ball towards the end of the season, did you see that? Or are you just reading the papers and watching SC?

I don't think anyone is denying Ben played poorly after coming back from injury.


Your logic on this site is ****, you're going after Rooney? Seriously, the guy pays the god damn players. If he wants to see more run than so be it. The Steelers are all of a sudden pressured due to the fact that this league is a pass happy league? You talk about running the ball to much when we have a lead in the 4th quarter, did you also bitch when Cowher did the same thing? Look up Cowhers record once and see what his win loss ratio was when going into the 4th quarter with a lead.

Art did go on a media tour this season talking about how the Steelers need to go back to emphasize running the football. And let's be honest, Haley was his hire. He deserves some blame for this and it's clear he's too involved in football operations. If Jerry Jones did that stuff, we'd be laughing at the Cowboys, but when Art Rooney II does it we all have to assume he's right.


Something you need to practice is patience, if you cant accept a 8-8 season and go off on the ledge and call for Ben to be traded/Rooney to stfu/Haley to be fired, then Id like to see how you would have handled a 4-12 season or 5-11. This team will miss the playoffs, they're not going to the sb every single season.

Losing to Oakland, Tennessee, Cleveland, and San Diego destroyed this season. That's probably more on Tomlin than anyone else.


Haley being a 1st year OC here in pitt can be graded atleast a B. Now you want him gone? So, if we hired another OC this season, lets say Whiz, he goes 9-7 and we still miss the playoffs, averaged 21 ppg. Would you want him gone? Maybe you should just be a raiders fan.

He shouldn't get a B - the Steelers did worse than last year and missed the playoffs. This offense was too concerned with ball control and did not put enough emphasis on scoring. Until the Steelers change their philosophies, they will not score many points on offense.

jpele
01-01-2013, 07:52 PM
I finally figured it out crash is BA son,thats why all the hate for Haley

Crash
01-01-2013, 08:16 PM
I really believe you're a delusional troll. So Ben was saving Haley's *** earlier this season, so when the debacle happened, Ben didnt save haley(due to poor decisions by Ben) Yet it was still Haley's fault. Wow.

Poor decisions? Or PREDICTABLE decisions?

First down at the Dallas 50.

Run run pass.

First down at the Bengals 32

Run run pass.

First down at the Steelers 46 in the Bengals game in a tie game?

WR screen run run run Ben scramble

First play of the Chargers game

WR screen to the right.

First play of the 2nd half against the Chargers

WR screen to the right, Paulson stuffed and blocked into the ball.

Teams watch film, teams pick up on **** all the time.


So when did Ben have enough time this season to actually throw the ball deep?

So you make time, you spread teams out, you roll the pocket, and you give him time to make a play deep.

Not every goddamn pass has to be a straight drop back.

Watch the first play of the Packers game in 2009.

Did we do that ONCE with Haley all year?


Ben didnt have the zip on the ball towards the end of the season, did you see that?

Bullshit. Watch the throw to Burress in the endzone, that was a ****ing rocket.

He was playing awesome in Dallas before that pick. Not an issue.


Your logic on this site is ****, you're going after Rooney? Seriously, the guy pays the god damn players. If he wants to see more run than so be it.

Then do it the right way. Trade Ben, load up on running backs and defense. You don't pay Ben Roethlisberger $15 million a year to hand off twice from the Bengals 32 when your season is on the line. You don't pay Ben Roethlisberger $15 million a year to hand off three times to a RB who was suspended the week before wioth three minutes to go in the goddamn game.


Look up Cowhers record once and see what his win loss ratio was when going into the 4th quarter with a lead.

You look it up. But, right now, I'll tell you that Bill Cowher blew two playoff games when he had a lead in the 4th quarter. Including the 1993 game at KC when he went Run run pass punt, when he needed a 1st down to win the game, when his quarterback had 3 TD passes up to that point.

See what happens when they value tradition over winning?


Something you need to practice is patience, if you cant accept a 8-8 season and go off on the ledge and call for Ben to be traded/Rooney to stfu/Haley to be fired, then Id like to see how you would have handled a 4-12 season or 5-11. This team will miss the playoffs, they're not going to the sb every single season.

We don't have time for patience. Ben will be 31 in March, what do you want to do? Waste his final prime years? And, if you do want patience, like I said, you trade him, you get picks for him, you clear your cap for 2 years, and then you start over.

You can't square peg round hole an entire team because an unqualified owner wants 1975 football. Having Ben Roethlisberger in this offense is like having Seabiscuit pulling a farmer's plow.


Haley being a 1st year OC here in pitt can be graded atleast a B.

Why? Because you say so? Here's one, Haley's brilliant offense got them 8-8.

First year OC Mike Mularkey went 13-3 and went to the AFC title game in 2001.

First year OC Whiz went 15-1 and Ben was rookie of the year in 2004.

First year OC Arians in 2007 went 10-6 and won his division and Ben threw 32 TD passes and Parker was leading the league in rushing.

Only golf coach Rooney puppet Todd Haley failed to make the playoffs in the last 4 times we changed OC's.

And you give him a B?

Spare me.

TarlsQtr
01-01-2013, 09:21 PM
I really believe you're a delusional troll. So Ben was saving Haley's *** earlier this season, so when the debacle happened, Ben didnt save haley(due to poor decisions by Ben) Yet it was still Haley's fault. Wow.

So when did Ben have enough time this season to actually throw the ball deep? How many times this season did we see Ben throw a pretty unaccurate deep ball? Yet, that is Haley's fault.

Also, no **** it's not Bens arm thats the issue, if you ever strained your chest, pulled a muscle in your chest, it effects your strength in your throwing motion. Ben didnt have the zip on the ball towards the end of the season, did you see that? Or are you just reading the papers and watching SC?

Your logic on this site is ****, you're going after Rooney? Seriously, the guy pays the god damn players. If he wants to see more run than so be it. The Steelers are all of a sudden pressured due to the fact that this league is a pass happy league? You talk about running the ball to much when we have a lead in the 4th quarter, did you also bitch when Cowher did the same thing? Look up Cowhers record once and see what his win loss ratio was when going into the 4th quarter with a lead.

Something you need to practice is patience, if you cant accept a 8-8 season and go off on the ledge and call for Ben to be traded/Rooney to stfu/Haley to be fired, then Id like to see how you would have handled a 4-12 season or 5-11. This team will miss the playoffs, they're not going to the sb every single season.

Haley being a 1st year OC here in pitt can be graded atleast a B. Now you want him gone? So, if we hired another OC this season, lets say Whiz, he goes 9-7 and we still miss the playoffs, averaged 21 ppg. Would you want him gone? Maybe you should just be a raiders fan.

That was a much needed a$$ whoopin', emphasis on a$$. Crash would be much better off as a Raider fan (and so would we).

RIVERS OF STEEL
01-01-2013, 10:20 PM
Bottom line with Haley. Nothing worked. So, what do you think he will try in 13? He really has a job now.

Crash
01-01-2013, 10:24 PM
That was a much needed a$$ whoopin', emphasis on a$$. Crash would be much better off as a Raider fan (and so would we).

You're nuts. My response to that totally kicked his ***. And he knows it.

steelchamp204
01-02-2013, 12:04 AM
You're nuts. My response to that totally kicked his ***. And he knows it.

Whatever gets your nuts off, it's just an internet forum. If you look at an internet forum to think you are the ****, I hate to say it but, you have low self esteem issues.

By the way, You completely ignored the offensive line issue this whole time. Remember when Whiz was the first year OC, look at how dominate that line was. If your going to say Ben saved Haley's as, you can pretty much say that Ben helped BA get his offensive co. job with the Colts also. Since Ben made BA look decent most of the time. Even though he threw way to many bubble screens as a "run" play to the slowest receiver we had on the field, good old Hines.

The thing with your argument is, all them 1st year guy you said that were great, they had one thing. A run game. Who did we have this year? 2 complimentary backs all season long behind a debacle of a line. Running backs who couldnt bounce the ball outside, that are in between the tackles running backs.

You emphasize pass pass pass, but what all great teams have is a solid offensive line, and a good running game. Doesnt HAVE to be great, but atleast good.

BlitzburghRockCity
01-02-2013, 12:15 AM
I don't want Whis back in Pittsburgh. He and Ben had issues getting along and deciding on how the offense should be run in the first place. A firm hand is always needed when it comes to a coach but bringing back old blood usually doesn't work IMO.

Real Deal Steel
01-02-2013, 11:06 AM
I don't want Whis back in Pittsburgh. He and Ben had issues getting along and deciding on how the offense should be run in the first place. A firm hand is always needed when it comes to a coach but bringing back old blood usually doesn't work IMO.

I agree. Plus..I didn't like Whis attitude afterward. He became a total traitor to the empire. He can stay out there and move to his next bad ballclub.

Nolrog
01-02-2013, 11:43 AM
I don't think an OC change is warranted. But if Haley did move on for HC job, then I'd want Norv Turner here.

Crash
01-02-2013, 11:56 AM
By the way, You completely ignored the offensive line issue this whole time.

You mean like last season? That didn't seem to help Arians did it?

Don't give the Pittsburgh guy the leeway Arians didn't get. As Coach Tomlin says "The standard is the standard".


If your going to say Ben saved Haley's as, you can pretty much say that Ben helped BA get his offensive co. job with the Colts also.

Absolutely. Just like he helped Whiz get the Cards job. Just like he would help Haley if he gets a job now.


The thing with your argument is, all them 1st year guy you said that were great, they had one thing. A run game. Who did we have this year? 2 complimentary backs all season long behind a debacle of a line. Running backs who couldnt bounce the ball outside, that are in between the tackles running backs.

They couldn't bounce it outside because we would often have 5 OLs, and 2 TE's, at the LOS blocking. There wasn't anywhere to go be because Haley's pea-brained scheme took it away from them.


You emphasize pass pass pass

Um, no I don't. I emphasize less predictability, when you have 5 OLs, 2 TEs, 1 WR, 1 RB, a FB, and Ben on the field? It's not hard for a defense to realize that you are running the ball.

Haley's BS rotation of backs also killed him. The ONLY TIME the run game worked all year, was against Washington, Cincy, and New York. Why? Injuries forced Haley to stop rotating backs as much as he did.

We also led the NFL in last 2 minute points. Why? Because when we NEED a score? The rookie undrafted FB is off the field. The rookie 7th round no hoper tight end, is off the field. And the three WRs are, aka the PLAY-MAKERS are.

Haley's micromanagement of the run game and his insistence of giving clowns like Johnson and Paulson snaps hurt his offense more than defenses did. And it has to stop if he remains.

If it does not? Expect more of the same.

NeilPatrickBanana
01-02-2013, 12:18 PM
i love this concoction. The interconnected simplicity is wildly entertaining.

Get7With7
01-02-2013, 12:49 PM
I don't want Whis back in Pittsburgh. He and Ben had issues getting along and deciding on how the offense should be run in the first place. A firm hand is always needed when it comes to a coach but bringing back old blood usually doesn't work IMO.

There might be more bad blood between Whiz and the Rooneys rather than Whiz and Ben.

Crash
01-02-2013, 01:29 PM
Ben got PO'd because after Whiz left, where as Ben took the blame for his play, Whiz blamed the motorcycle accident for Ben's 2006 season.

They apparently worked it out prior to XLIII in a sit down, and have golfed together since.

BlitzburghRockCity
01-04-2013, 09:38 AM
I still believe Haley will be back next season, but if he isn't then give me Norv Turner in a hot second. He may have failed as a head coach but with the right weapons on offense he could be a beast for us.