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Blitzburgh_Mike
11-07-2012, 01:28 PM
Assuming Dwyer is healthy to play this week (as well as assuming Mendenhall will be out again this week), who do you think will get the bulk of the carries? I believe that it probably should go to Dwyer, but I could easily see Haley splitting the carries 50/50. Who do you think will/should get the start?

Real Deal Steel
11-07-2012, 01:31 PM
Dwyer.

steelchamp204
11-07-2012, 02:14 PM
It HAS to be Dwyer. He deserves the starting Job for now. He has been steady the past few weeks besides last week(injury). Red will mget some of the load, maybe about 12 carries or so depending on how much they want to run the ball. I think Reds struggles at the beggining of the year were due to the lack of push the Oline was getting off the ball. People made a big deal when Mendy came back but I think even Mendy wouldnt have been able to run behind that Oline the first 3 weeks or so of the season.

Dwyer

BlitzburghRockCity
11-07-2012, 02:30 PM
This will be a question for not only this week but for the rest of the year. When Mendy comes back do you start him? Who gets the bulk of the carries until then, JD or IRed? I still say you go with the hot hand, and always go with the hot hand. The NFL shouldn't guarantee you your job back when you get hurt; mainly in cases where there is no clear cut starter. Obviously an elite QB is a different story for example, but there is no clear cut, head n shoulders above the rest RB right now. They've all done well in spot duty but nobody can stay healthy long enough to put anything more than 2 games together.

Remember earlier this year, Redman and Dwyer played together and neither one of them was productive. Hopefully things are different now as both are likely the main guys again.

steelchamp204
11-07-2012, 02:40 PM
This will be a question for not only this week but for the rest of the year. When Mendy comes back do you start him? Who gets the bulk of the carries until then, JD or IRed? I still say you go with the hot hand, and always go with the hot hand. The NFL shouldn't guarantee you your job back when you get hurt; mainly in cases where there is no clear cut starter. Obviously an elite QB is a different story for example, but there is no clear cut, head n shoulders above the rest RB right now. They've all done well in spot duty but nobody can stay healthy long enough to put anything more than 2 games together.

Remember earlier this year, Redman and Dwyer played together and neither one of them was productive. Hopefully things are different now as both are likely the main guys again.

If Dwyer runs this week like he did against Cincy, Mendenhall will be the second back for the rest of the year.

Goodfrom55
11-07-2012, 03:00 PM
IMO, they are both similar in running styles, it comes down to who is a better pass protector (blitz pick up), who is healthier, who takes better care of the ball, who is better as a receiver out of the backfield? If it is a tie, then they should split carries. Provided the Steelers are comfortably ahead, I split the carries equally between them - maybe 15 to 20 each.

steelersbabex25
11-07-2012, 04:24 PM
Question, why does it HAVE to be Dwyer. Redman had a 100+ yard game against a dominant defense.

Goodfrom55
11-07-2012, 04:47 PM
There is no clear cut starter; it has been healthiest guy plays week to week. If/when Mendy is ready to play, IMO, he should get the nod to start. . .No Wally Pipps here -

Funny thing about Redman and Dwyer is they both earned playing time with their recent play, so I go with whoever does the little things better plays more snaps (pass block, blitz pickup, etc).

Real Deal Steel
11-07-2012, 05:14 PM
I've already gone on record as saying Dwyer is better then Mendy as an overall runningback.

Mendy and Wallace will be looking for big money. The Front office will determine their value to this team in the off-season. We have a plethara of wide receivers and runningbacks so I don't see either being resigned for big money.

With that said..that will end the debates of who's better Dwyer/Mendy and Wallace/Brown. The front office will decide.

K Train
11-07-2012, 06:13 PM
Question, why does it HAVE to be Dwyer. Redman had a 100+ yard game against a dominant defense.

there is nothing dominant about the giants defense except their pass rush

they are going to be a classic RBBC from here out and i doesnt matter whos running if the oline is moving peopler like they are

Goodfrom55
11-07-2012, 06:57 PM
Mendy is in no position to look for big money, but I do see your point.

K Train
11-07-2012, 07:31 PM
yeah just cause mendenhall was a first round pick doenst mean he'll demand big money, hes a good back but hes not going to demand top dollar

Real Deal Steel
11-07-2012, 07:48 PM
Now of course I'd like to keep them all. But we know how realistic that is in a salary cap world.

steelchamp204
11-08-2012, 01:33 AM
Question, why does it HAVE to be Dwyer. Redman had a 100+ yard game against a dominant defense.

Babe, you know Ive been a Redman supporter for awhile. I just think Dwyer has a little more athletic ability than Red. I think the combo of Dwyer/Red would be a great duo to wear down defenses. Then having Rainey be the Mewelde Moore type special back. I think Dwyer and Red should be about 60/40 for carries, that is IF we dont resign Mendenhall which could be a possibility.

steelersbabex25
11-08-2012, 08:32 AM
Babe, you know Ive been a Redman supporter for awhile. I just think Dwyer has a little more athletic ability than Red. I think the combo of Dwyer/Red would be a great duo to wear down defenses. Then having Rainey be the Mewelde Moore type special back. I think Dwyer and Red should be about 60/40 for carries, that is IF we dont resign Mendenhall which could be a possibility.

I'm not not quite understanding the logic. Dwyer produced one game, Redman produced the same if not more the next game. For the Chiefs, play Redman and make sure Dwyer is completely healthy. For the Ravens, if Mendy isn't back (I don't really know his status because I don't care about him anymore), split the carries 50/50. Simple.

JensK
11-08-2012, 11:35 AM
I'm not not quite understanding the logic. Dwyer produced one game, Redman produced the same if not more the next game. For the Chiefs, play Redman and make sure Dwyer is completely healthy. For the Ravens, if Mendy isn't back (I don't really know his status because I don't care about him anymore), split the carries 50/50. Simple.

You do know Dwyer was the first Steelers RB to have back-to-back 100y games since Willie Parker a looong time ago right? Id say that is producing in more than one game.

Either way, I agree that they could share the load. I would prefer Dwyer as the primary runner though. I just think he is the better RB, even though Redman had a great game.

steelersbabex25
11-08-2012, 11:38 AM
You do know Dwyer was the first Steelers RB to have back-to-back 100y games since Willie Parker a looong time ago right? Id say that is producing in more than one game.

Either way, I agree that they could share the load. I would prefer Dwyer as the primary runner though. I just think he is the better RB, even though Redman had a great game.

Semantics!! :lol:

Yeah I forgot about that. I say give Redman all the carries on Monday and he'd definitely rack up over 100 yards as well, though.

steelchamp204
11-08-2012, 12:14 PM
I'm not not quite understanding the logic. Dwyer produced one game, Redman produced the same if not more the next game. For the Chiefs, play Redman and make sure Dwyer is completely healthy. For the Ravens, if Mendy isn't back (I don't really know his status because I don't care about him anymore), split the carries 50/50. Simple.

He has only produced "one" game. His past two "starts" he has averaged over 6ypc with no more than 17 attempts at running the ball.

LatrobePA
11-08-2012, 12:35 PM
Both!

DIESELMAN
11-08-2012, 01:01 PM
Here is a article on this question, it may or may not clear it up lol


Steelers' Mendenhall to start when healthy

By Jamison Hensley | Nov 8, 2012 12:44 AM
Steelers running backs coach Kirby Wilson knows who will be Pittsburgh's starting back and it's not one of the players who has gained more than 100 yards over the past three weeks.

Rashard Mendenhall will remain the Steelers' starting running back when he's recovered from an Achilles injury. According to The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, he is likely another week away from playing.


Mendenhall
“Rashard has always been our lead dog and our top runner,” Wilson told the paper.

The Steelers have put together a productive ground game without Mendenhall. Jonathan Dwyer had consecutive 100-yard rushing games before missing Sunday with a quad injury. Isaac Redman rushed for a career-high 147 yards last Sunday.

Head coach Mike Tomlin said earlier this week that the running back who is having the most success during the game will get the ball the most. The first opportunity, according to Wilson, will go to Mendenhall, who had 101 total yards on Oct. 7 against Philadelphia (his only full game this season).

“Rashard is the complete package -- power, speed, explosiveness,” Wilson said. “He is the guy who can take a 10-yard run and make people miss and get 20 more. We think Jonathan has things that he is great at. Isaac has some things that he is great at. But Rashard is the complete package. Rashard has proved that he can do it over the long haul.”

I would've stuck with Dwyer based on his recent success and his running style. Dwyer became the first Steelers running back in four seasons to gain 100 yards in back-to-back games. He's earned the right to get the first shot at starting when everyone is healthy.

Another reason to go with Dwyer is he's a combination of Mendenhall and Redman. Dwyer can break long runs to the outside like Mendenhall and gain the tough yards in between the tackles like Redman. Mendenhall has a tendency to be impatient and wants to bounce runs to the outside too quickly.

There's a chance that the Steelers could go with a running back by committee. But offensive tackle Max Starks said this week that the offensive line favors one featured back because the blockers can get into a rhythm.

The Steelers may not have to make a decision about Mendenhall, who is considered questionable for Monday night's game against the Chiefs. Dwyer has a good shot at playing after being inactive last Sunday.

Me personally, I would rather see Dwyer as the primary with Redman spelling him. Dwyer has definitely earned it. We need to go with what is working, let Mendy rest up for the playoffs.

Big T
11-08-2012, 01:33 PM
“Rashard is the complete package -- power, speed, explosiveness,” Wilson said. “He is the guy who can take a 10-yard run and make people miss and get 20 more. We think Jonathan has things that he is great at. Isaac has some things that he is great at. But Rashard is the complete package. Rashard has proved that he can do it over the long haul.”

Sure sounds a lot like me doesn't it? Lol. Hey Real Deal Steel, not to get this whole ordeal started up again, but do you remember what you've always said? I can't remember exactly what you've said but it was something along the lines of the coaches know more than we do and their words/actions will show who's ultimately right/wrong in a lot of our debates...

I mean, I feel like Kirby Wilson knows more about our RBs than you and I combined. Wouldn't you agree?

tburg68
11-08-2012, 01:34 PM
I have always said that I believe the RB talent is ranked as follows: Mendy, Dwyer, Redman. I believe the carrys should be allocated based on that, health considered.

That being said, with the improvement of the O-Line, I don't see Mendy with the Steelers next year. I hope I'm wrong on that, but I just get a feeling that he's(Mendy) gone.

Big T
11-08-2012, 01:36 PM
I have always said that I believe the RB talent is ranked as follows: Mendy, Dwyer, Redman. I believe the carrys should be allocated based on that, health considered.

That being said, with the improvement of the O-Line, I don't see Mendy with the Steelers next year. I hope I'm wrong on that, but I just get a feeling that he's(Mendy) gone.

Agreed.

greg1964
11-08-2012, 01:55 PM
Dwyer is the starter, Redman is short yardage and goal line: bit other sit when Menendhall is ready

TarlsQtr
11-08-2012, 03:57 PM
With that said..that will end the debates of who's better Dwyer/Mendy and Wallace/Brown. The front office will decide.

That's not true at all. Rod Woodson was probably still our best DB when he left but he was not the best VALUE. He was going to earn more (from someone) than the Steelers were willing to pay him. The same is true of your examples above. If Wallace leaves, it is not necessarily because they think Brown to be better. Steelers history since the salary cap is littered with pro bowlers who were let go not because they had a better replacement but because they had one who gave more value.

BLACKandGOLD
11-08-2012, 08:44 PM
If Dwyer is able to go then definitely give him the bulk of the carries. Until he shows me that hes not the hot hand anymore then keep handing it off to him. Redman will be great to throw in the mix when Dwyer comes out

Real Deal Steel
11-09-2012, 12:19 AM
Sure sounds a lot like me doesn't it? Lol. Hey Real Deal Steel, not to get this whole ordeal started up again, but do you remember what you've always said? I can't remember exactly what you've said but it was something along the lines of the coaches know more than we do and their words/actions will show who's ultimately right/wrong in a lot of our debates...

I mean, I feel like Kirby Wilson knows more about our RBs than you and I combined. Wouldn't you agree?

What is he suppose to say at this point? That in fact Dwyer is better? So then there is disruption in the locker room? He's saying the PC thing right now. And I wouldn't want him to say any different. But in the off-season, you'll see BY THE ACTIONS OF THE FRONT OFFICE who is really the better guy.

Mendy isn't the better RB. Dances too much. Fumbles too much. The only thing he has better then Dwyer is straight line speed. When Mendy is gone next year, you'll have amnesia about what your saying. That's why I've captured it.

Real Deal Steel
11-09-2012, 12:22 AM
If Dwyer is able to go then definitely give him the bulk of the carries. Until he shows me that hes not the hot hand anymore then keep handing it off to him. Redman will be great to throw in the mix when Dwyer comes out

I'd like to see them use Dwyer between the 20's and then bring redman in on the redzone carries. Just a thought.

Big T
11-09-2012, 01:01 AM
No amnesia here. I've always been a Mendenhall fan and always will be. As well as Dwyer. Mendenhall may not be here next season but it won't be because Dwyer is better. It'll be because Dwyer and Redman will be cheaper, and can get the job done behind this O line that has been dominating the run game.

Real Deal Steel
11-09-2012, 07:19 AM
There never is an answer for you. If Mendy was really better, the front office would find a way to keep him. When all the things are put on the table, overall, Dwyer is the better runningback. I don't hate Mendy. I like him too. But Dwyer is just the better runningback.

SnakeEyes43
11-09-2012, 08:56 AM
On paper, and if Mendy is healthy, he and Dwyer are like a dream team. We just can't get both healthy at the same time.

And yes, I see Mendy going elsewhere next year.

BLACKandGOLD
11-09-2012, 10:19 AM
I'd like to see them use Dwyer between the 20's and then bring redman in on the redzone carries. Just a thought.

I do like Redman in the redzone. Dwyer has a better chance of breaking a big one and then Redman can do the dirty work in short yardage

tburg68
11-09-2012, 11:30 AM
If the front office always found a way to keep the best player, then Woodson, Plaxico, Holmes............would have all retired/still be with the Steelers. The front offices of all NFL teams, and all sports teams don't/can't always keep the better player. To make this argument is foolish.

Real Deal Steel
11-09-2012, 11:53 PM
If the front office always found a way to keep the best player, then Woodson, Plaxico, Holmes............would have all retired/still be with the Steelers. The front offices of all NFL teams, and all sports teams don't/can't always keep the better player. To make this argument is foolish.

Look, you can be the Mendy supporter all you want. That's great. But I gave specifics why Mendy isn't better then Dwyer. And I stand by them. If they felt Mendy was all that, they could find a way to sign him. But because Dwyer is better and less expensive, it's a no brainer. To think anything else..is foolish.

coach
11-10-2012, 02:54 PM
I want to see the O-Line dominate and just punish teams and tell them that we are going to run and you cant stop us until you bring 8 in the box; then then send all your speed at WR down the field and punish the DBS. I dont care if we run it all day and alternate both backs every other play. The result is all I care for. I was loving that performance against the Giants on the road. 5 or 6 games ago, I didnt think that was possible. Just keep improving the run game.

Real Deal Steel
11-10-2012, 08:10 PM
I agree. Just run the damn ball man! :lol:

tburg68
11-10-2012, 11:35 PM
Look, you can be the Mendy supporter all you want. That's great. But I gave specifics why Mendy isn't better then Dwyer. And I stand by them. If they felt Mendy was all that, they could find a way to sign him. But because Dwyer is better and less expensive, it's a no brainer. To think anything else..is foolish.

You're wrong. Every year teams let better players go, because they are deemed too expensive, not because the player they keep is better. Period

Real Deal Steel
11-11-2012, 01:31 AM
Fine. Whatever gets you through the nite. But I don't see other teams letting their best runningback go. Hahahahahahaha. Guess the Vikings are going to let AP go next. I guess the new contract that Arian Foster just got is a mirage too. Hahahahaaha.

Those runningbacks are kept because their the best runningbacks on those teams. So why is Mendy going to be allowed to walk? Because he isn't the best on this team.

Whatever gets you through the nite homes.

steelchamp204
11-11-2012, 01:45 AM
Fine. Whatever gets you through the nite. But I don't see other teams letting their best runningback go. Hahahahahahaha. Guess the Vikings are going to let AP go next. I guess the new contract that Arian Foster just got is a mirage too. Hahahahaaha.

Those runningbacks are kept because their the best runningbacks on those teams. So why is Mendy going to be allowed to walk? Because he isn't the best on this team.

Whatever gets you through the nite homes.

It doesnt really matter what happens, we can run without Mendy also. Next man up as Tomlin would say :)

TarlsQtr
11-11-2012, 01:56 AM
Fine. Whatever gets you through the nite. But I don't see other teams letting their best runningback go. Hahahahahahaha. Guess the Vikings are going to let AP go next. I guess the new contract that Arian Foster just got is a mirage too. Hahahahaaha.

Those runningbacks are kept because their the best runningbacks on those teams. So why is Mendy going to be allowed to walk? Because he isn't the best on this team.

Whatever gets you through the nite homes.

Dude, do you speak in anything but logical fallacies? False choices, straw men, red herrings, you have them all. No one is saying that Mendy is Foster or AP. Many are not even saying that Mendy is better than Dwyer (your merely subjective "evidence" that Dwyer is better notwithstanding). If you cannot see that teams, especially the Steelers, let better players go in free agency ALL THE TIME for cheaper alternatives, then you are completely delusional. Letting Mendy go this offseason does NOT necessarily mean that the FO believes Dwyer is better even if he is your baby daddy. Heck, he has not even beaten out Redman in Tomlin's eyes yet or they would not be sharing snaps this week.

Who was better than Woodson when he left? Eric Green? Mike Merriweather? The Steelers do not overpay (or even pay market) when they have so much depth at a position.

Real Deal Steel
11-12-2012, 01:31 AM
It was obvious how good Woodson was. It is not obvious in anyway that Mendy is better then Dwyer. So..the front office will make a decision on who they feel is the best for the team going forward. When they let Mendy go, it's because they feel that Dwyer is just as good or better. In this particular situation, it's that simple.

I'll end it on that note. Because it's all repetitive now.

TarlsQtr
11-12-2012, 01:51 AM
It was obvious how good Woodson was. It is not obvious in anyway that Mendy is better then Dwyer. So..the front office will make a decision on who they feel is the best for the team going forward. When they let Mendy go, it's because they feel that Dwyer is just as good or better. In this particular situation, it's that simple.

I'll end it on that note. Because it's all repetitive now.

I heard your retreat bugle from here.

Yes, it is obvious that Woodson was better, which shoots your original statement (that who a team keeps indicates who they think is better)all to he!!.

You being so cocksure that a back with fewer career starts than fingers on one hand is better than one who has produced over full seasons (with a TERRIBLE OL) is as absurd as comparing Mendy to AP or Foster. Then again, you did that too.

In fact, you provided a PRESEASON GAME as "proof" that your baby daddy was better, so I should not be surprised.

If Dwyer ends up better-and he may-it will not be because of any astute analysis on your part but because of dumb luck-emphasis on "dumb."

tburg68
11-12-2012, 10:49 AM
Dude, do you speak in anything but logical fallacies? False choices, straw men, red herrings, you have them all. No one is saying that Mendy is Foster or AP. Many are not even saying that Mendy is better than Dwyer (your merely subjective "evidence" that Dwyer is better notwithstanding). If you cannot see that teams, especially the Steelers, let better players go in free agency ALL THE TIME for cheaper alternatives, then you are completely delusional. Letting Mendy go this offseason does NOT necessarily mean that the FO believes Dwyer is better even if he is your baby daddy. Heck, he has not even beaten out Redman in Tomlin's eyes yet or they would not be sharing snaps this week.

Who was better than Woodson when he left? Eric Green? Mike Merriweather? The Steelers do not overpay (or even pay market) when they have so much depth at a position.


I heard your retreat bugle from here.

Yes, it is obvious that Woodson was better, which shoots your original statement (that who a team keeps indicates who they think is better)all to he!!.

You being so cocksure that a back with fewer career starts than fingers on one hand is better than one who has produced over full seasons (with a TERRIBLE OL) is as absurd as comparing Mendy to AP or Foster. Then again, you did that too.

In fact, you provided a PRESEASON GAME as "proof" that your baby daddy was better, so I should not be surprised.

If Dwyer ends up better-and he may-it will not be because of any astute analysis on your part but because of dumb luck-emphasis on "dumb."

Both of these.^^

The only thing that is sure, is that Real Deal loves the sound of his own voice.

Real Deal Steel
11-12-2012, 11:27 AM
I heard your retreat bugle from here.

Yes, it is obvious that Woodson was better, which shoots your original statement (that who a team keeps indicates who they think is better)all to he!!.

You being so cocksure that a back with fewer career starts than fingers on one hand is better than one who has produced over full seasons (with a TERRIBLE OL) is as absurd as comparing Mendy to AP or Foster. Then again, you did that too.

In fact, you provided a PRESEASON GAME as "proof" that your baby daddy was better, so I should not be surprised.

If Dwyer ends up better-and he may-it will not be because of any astute analysis on your part but because of dumb luck-emphasis on "dumb."

There is no retreat okay you retard.

The Woodson matter is in no way the same as the the Mendy/Dwyer situation. Apples and Oranges you idiot.
The only person in this room who is dumb is you. Because in reality (and reality is all that matters) the better man wins. You can spin it any way you want to help you feel better about your stupid beliefs but the fact is that I called this TWO YEARS AGO when Dwyer was drafted. So that blows your "dumb luck" theory out the water.

I'm done with this topic because the bottom line is that I called it. From the drafting of Dwyer. As for you Tarlsqtr, since you want to get personal, why don't you go back to your trailer home and sit and have conversation with your mom, who's probably your cousin (inbreeding) and continue to talk about your old dead dog. Or whatever you country hicks talk about. Gzzz

I'm out. On to the next topic.

TarlsQtr
11-12-2012, 08:48 PM
When virtually the entire thread feels you are wrong, it is time for some self-reflection.

You keep saying "the better man wins", but NFL salary cap history-especially with the Steelers-is littered with "better men" that ended up on other teams.

Your entire MO on this board is to declare your opinion as "fact" and "reality." Get the dictionary out from under your couch leg and compare the definitions of "fact" and "opinion."

"Inbreeding" is the best you can do? Really? I'll compare my two Masters degrees to your "edumucation" any day.