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elephantman
03-09-2012, 07:28 AM
next yr Brown will be a RFA....if we keep wallace we will have troible with keeping Brown...and lets not forget Sanders who I think wil have a break out yr...who would u prefer if it's one or the other...to me it's easy...BROWN...better route runner better hands and not as fast as wallace but pretty fast...I dont want to lose him but would be happy to get a 1st rounder for wallace

harpo
03-09-2012, 08:35 AM
I honestly don't think they will be able to keep all three. I think that if the Steelers sign Wallace, Sanders will be the odd man out. It's unfortunate because I like all three. However, I wouldn't be upset if Wallace wasn't signed and opted somewhere like, say San Francisco. If Sanders has a break out year, it's going to make it even harder to keep all three.

With that said, my "man-love" is known on this board for Antonio Brown, so i'm going to be bias and say I prefer AB over the others. :banana:

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 08:44 AM
I'm sorry but I dont get all the "don't mind if we lose Wallace for a 1st rounder sentiment". Don't get me wrong, if Wallace decides on another team, hell yes i want the Steelers to get a first rd pick as compensation. I'm talking in general terms, elephantman, because I don't think you want to lose Wallace either, but we finally have a strong field of players in one skill set, man i would love to see that continue. I want both, they open up areas for each other imo. I'd rather cut Foote, Essex, Gay, and Sepulveda or other freeloaders than some one who actually makes a difference for the team I watch on sunday.

MDSteel15
03-09-2012, 09:06 AM
How about we act like a principal and take them all into the office and say "Look, do you want to be greedy little bastards or do you want to be part of something special? This unit has the chance to make history everytime we step on the field! To be special means we need to spread the joy between the 3 of you which will mean big rewards on the back end." It can't hurt to try!!!

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 09:23 AM
How about we act like a principal and take them all into the office and say "Look, do you want to be greedy little bastards or do you want to be part of something special? This unit has the chance to make history everytime we step on the field! To be special means we need to spread the joy between the 3 of you which will mean big rewards on the back end." It can't hurt to try!!!

The "Bounty"full Saints do it, they spread the field with their dynamic tight end, Graham. I love Haley and I have yet to see play one. I'm excited for the steelers offense this year.

K Train
03-09-2012, 09:56 AM
its not like they are all going to command larry fitzgerald money, sanders hasnt done anything o i cant imagine resigning him will be an issue if they even want to in the first place

strummerfan
03-09-2012, 10:13 AM
If I had to make a choice it would be Brown. As it stands he has better hands and runs better routes.

K Train
03-09-2012, 10:17 AM
brown isnt really that good of a route runner

harpo
03-09-2012, 10:25 AM
brown isnt really that good of a route runner

Neither is Wallace.....

strummerfan
03-09-2012, 10:28 AM
brown isnt really that good of a route runner

He's better than Wallace and he also uses his hands as opposed to catching against his body like Wallace.

K Train
03-09-2012, 10:30 AM
best route runner on the team=heath miller lol

then sanders and cotchery.

im actually not too sure about wallace, BA had him go deep or run screens so its tough to judge. Brown seems to always be open but its due to fearlessness, not route running

harpo
03-09-2012, 10:44 AM
Wallace has never been a good route runner. He wasn't a good route runner in college, which was one of the "cons" on his college scouting report.

NHSteeler
03-09-2012, 10:49 AM
BROWN. He is the more natural WR and has made big-time catches in tough circumstances (not to mention an awesome returner).

I don't want the FO to break the bank for Wally. I like him, but he isn't elite. I never seen him make a catch that made me say "Wow, how did he grab that!" Can he be elite???? :thinking:

That question leads me to what I hope happens.............................

The FO signs Wally to the one-year tender. This would give the Steelers leverage/money to sign Cotchery and maybe a REASONABLE free agent. Wally gets another year (and under Haley) to raise his game.

Don't underestimate the fact that Sanders and Brown didn't have the offseason last year. I believe it takes players their first year to get used to the speed of the game. Then, they settle down and can learn their system, poistion, etc..... Keep an eye on our (and the rest of the league's) 3rd year players.

Lets see how the WRs play this upcoming season, and then see who gets paid. Even if Wally breaks out and then leaves next year, we still could have Brown, Sanders, Crotchery.

K Train
03-09-2012, 10:58 AM
thats just not true, i know everyones on this "wallace doesnt fight for the ball" kick since you are unhappy with his second half production last year but the man has elite ball adjustment skills when the ball is in the air, hes a lot like randy moss in his ball adjustment.

and never making a wow catch, the packers his rookie year to win the game is one that jumps out to me. how many wow catches did ward make? i can think of 1 in superbowl XL....holmes has made a career of wow catches, but thats besides the point lol

SteelDad
03-09-2012, 11:05 AM
Sanders future relies strictly on his health. If he continues to be in and out of the lineup I think it becomes a no-brainer and he is not re-signed.

Brown and Wallace have some similar traits, but in terms of overall value, I'd keep Brown because of his ability in the return game. I totally disagree BTW with him not being the return man in 2012.

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:14 AM
Sanders future relies strictly on his health. If he continues to be in and out of the lineup I think it becomes a no-brainer and he is not re-signed.

Brown and Wallace have some similar traits, but in terms of overall value, I'd keep Brown because of his ability in the return game. I totally disagree BTW with him not being the return man in 2012.

I agree, everytime we get a viable return guy, they are deemed too valuable for the offense. The Eagles have DeSean returning kicks don't they?

K Train
03-09-2012, 11:20 AM
jackson returns punts, which brown will probably continue to do....KRing is way more brutal, its dumb to have a starting WR do it

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:25 AM
jackson returns punts, which brown will probably continue to do....KRing is way more brutal, its dumb to have a starting WR do it

who returns kick offs anyway this year. yes I get your point.

connecticutsteel
03-09-2012, 11:25 AM
YOUTH DOESN'T COST MONEY IN THE NFL. If they structure the contracts right it will be easier to keep everyone signed. The cap problems the Steelers had was more about the new CBA vs the old CBA the old CBA was unlimited money flowing in every direction for t6he players now the owner reigned it in so every position is assigned a value QB'S are the highest paid

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:27 AM
the bottom line: if I were to choose between the two, Antonio Brown.

K Train
03-09-2012, 11:29 AM
probably sanders will return kicks, but im sure a draft pick will get a chance too...if they draft brandon boykin or someone like that they will be the primary kick returner

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:31 AM
Brown, and Sanders over Wallace. Two is better than one!!!! Rams need a WR why not sign Wallace and offer to Rams for #2 pick so we can grab Blackmon......Best talent I've seen in a while!

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:32 AM
Wallace for a #2 is daydreaming.

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:33 AM
Wallace for a #2 is daydreaming.Yeah i know but just a wish!!

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:37 AM
Yeah i know but just a wish!!
it would be nice wouldn't it?

K Train
03-09-2012, 11:39 AM
Brown, and Sanders over Wallace. Two is better than one!!!! Rams need a WR why not sign Wallace and offer to Rams for #2 pick so we can grab Blackmon......Best talent I've seen in a while!

blackmon is not that good, hes a beneficiary of a weak class (at the top at least) and a rookie salary cap. Wallace>>>>Blackmon

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:42 AM
blackmon is not that good, hes a beneficiary of a weak class (at the top at least) and a rookie salary cap. Wallace>>>>BlackmonYou disagree w/ everything....Blackmon is very good......I've watch this dude a lot.....he lives up to the hype around him.....we'd benefit from his services more than a go deep all the time WR!

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:44 AM
WR hype aside, I'd rather see off. line help or def. line depth in the first rd. imho.

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:46 AM
Funny thing is.....I was saying to get rid of all these washed up players before the superbowl in 2010 like WARD..FARRIOR...SMITH...GAY...MENDENHALL(NOT WASHED UP, BUT WEAK RUNNER)...EVEN ZIGGY HOOD...HE TAKES A LOT OF PLAYS OFF, NOT A GOOD PASS RUSHER...ANYWAY WE COULD OF SAVED A LOT OF TIME AND MONEY THIS OFF SEASON!!! IJS!

K Train
03-09-2012, 11:50 AM
You disagree w/ everything....Blackmon is very good......I've watch this dude a lot.....he lives up to the hype around him.....we'd benefit from his services more than a go deep all the time WR!

floyd is better than blackmon imo, but blackmon has hakeem nicks/greg jennigns ability. but hes not in the julio jones/aj green teier of first round WRs, hes much more in the kenny britt/hakeem nicks late first rounders type. Hes not even as good as his former team mate dez bryant, but comes with similar character concerns and very questionable speed at this point.

imo if the rams trade that number 2 pick to lets say washington for #6 they would be far better off taking wallace over blackmon. lets not make wallace out to seem THAT one dimensional just cause were annoyed he fell off in production the last 6 games

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 11:54 AM
I don't see Hood taking any plays off. Maybe you game film guys disagree, but ironhead and ziggy kill it imo.

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:55 AM
floyd is better than blackmon imo, but blackmon has hakeem nicks/greg jennigns ability. but hes not in the julio jones/aj green teier of first round WRs, hes much more in the kenny britt/hakeem nicks late first rounders type. Hes not even as good as his former team mate dez bryant, but comes with similar character concerns and very questionable speed at this point.

imo if the rams trade that number 2 pick to lets say washington for #6 they would be far better off taking wallace over blackmon. lets not make wallace out to seem THAT one dimensional just cause were annoyed he fell off in production the last 6 gamesI understand your points...but production falls off when you're one dimensional.....

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 11:56 AM
I don't see Hood taking any plays off. Maybe you game film guys disagree, but ironhead and ziggy kill it imo.He doesn't attack at all....he gets coverage sacks....5.5 in two years...need more from him!!!

coldrolled
03-09-2012, 11:57 AM
i still think we should have kept kemo and all the offensive players. haley will change the outlook of this crew.. if they dont work out in training camp then cut them, i still think arians made all defenses look good against us... bens ankle and arians non adjustments didnt help wallace either. if we lose wallace we gain the pick. if we dont we need to pick up a FA OL quick. Good one.

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 12:00 PM
He's better than Wallace and he also uses his hands as opposed to catching against his body like Wallace.

i just don't understand the criticism... . I think he's a helluva WR, with break away speed. no team can use that....oh ... wait.. yes we can.........

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 12:04 PM
keep Kemo re u serious??? (referring to colrolled post)

K Train
03-09-2012, 12:04 PM
Hood just tries to bend the corner like an OLB rather than taking on his blocks, he doesnt have the speed for that and ends up being pushed out of the play or put on his ***..when hes lined up over ceneter he wins. Hes a high motor player, doesnt take plays off but hes not fit for the position

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 12:09 PM
He doesn't attack at all....he gets coverage sacks....5.5 in two years...need more from him!!!

You and Ktrain make good points but he occupies blockers like a 3-4 def. lineman should. stats are never favorable imo.

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 12:12 PM
You and Ktrain make good points but he occupies blockers like a 3-4 def. lineman should. stats are never favorable imo.You're prolly right he just isn't the Joel Steed, Kevin Henry type to me. Check out some film on this guy......imo he takes a lot of plays off!!

K Train
03-09-2012, 12:20 PM
sack stats arent really accurate in evaluating hood, watching him get up after being blown off the ball is a good indication of how he plays 34 end, which is not very well..

kinda off topic now though

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 12:27 PM
Back to the topic then, brown has much more to offer than Wallace although I like both as WR's.

Real Deal Steel
03-09-2012, 01:14 PM
Brown is a "more complete" wide receiver then Wallace.

And now that Haley is running the offense, he will demand better route running from the wide receivers. Brown is the better route runner as of now.

But I see Haley raising the level of play for both of them.

MDSteel15
03-09-2012, 03:14 PM
He doesn't attack at all....he gets coverage sacks....5.5 in two years...need more from him!!!

Are you kidding? It's not his job to get sacks in this defense! As a DE in our D it is a bonus to get sacks! Check Keisel and ASmith's sack totals.. Ziggy has done a good job, but he could do better at the push into the backfield!

ldvious15
03-09-2012, 05:18 PM
Are you kidding? It's not his job to get sacks in this defense! As a DE in our D it is a bonus to get sacks! Check Keisel and ASmith's sack totals.. Ziggy has done a good job, but he could do better at the push into the backfield!OK maybe not to get sacks.....but he gets no pressure at all!!!

jpele
03-09-2012, 06:47 PM
thats just not true, i know everyones on this "wallace doesnt fight for the ball" kick since you are unhappy with his second half production last year but the man has elite ball adjustment skills when the ball is in the air, hes a lot like randy moss in his ball adjustment.

and never making a wow catch, the packers his rookie year to win the game is one that jumps out to me. how many wow catches did ward make? i can think of 1 in superbowl XL....holmes has made a career of wow catches, but thats besides the point lol

If you've only seen Ward make one "wow" catch you're either blinded by your hate and bias towards Hines or you haven't watched many games

Goodfrom55
03-09-2012, 08:37 PM
They compliment each other because the secondary can't double everyone. With Wallace's speed, you have to double him which makes getting open easeir for Brown and Sanders, etc. Brown is good and Sanders has shown potential, but I wonder how well Brown would facing double coverage every week.

tburg68
03-09-2012, 10:03 PM
Wallace's drop in production, had as much to do with Ben's health as anything. Arians didn't give him much to work with. I love Brown, but he is better playing next to Wallace. Don't understand all the love for Sanders, he hasn't really done anything yet.

FWIW, Holmes may have been the most TALENTED Steeler WR of all time.

jnes1216
03-09-2012, 10:24 PM
Wallace's drop in production, had as much to do with Ben's health as anything. Arians didn't give him much to work with. I love Brown, but he is better playing next to Wallace. Don't understand all the love for Sanders, he hasn't really done anything yet.

FWIW, Holmes may have been the most TALENTED Steeler WR of all time.

i disagree Sanders will kill it. give it time.. but i agree with you on one point santanio is very talented. my sour diesel joints are killer. i damn near pick my teeth with those reefers.

tburg68
03-10-2012, 05:43 PM
i disagree Sanders will kill it. give it time.. but i agree with you on one point santanio is very talented. my sour diesel joints are killer. i damn near pick my teeth with those reefers.

My arguement is that Sanders hasn't done anything yet, but people talk of him with more love than Wallace. You counter that Sanders WILL kill it. Good job.

connecticutsteel
03-10-2012, 09:45 PM
It is too early in brown's career to call Holmes the most talented of all time.plus you can have all the talent in the world if you smoke it all away it doesn't matter let's face it without an elite QB Holmes has been pedestrian at best.

Wallace's drop in production had to do with teams doubling him or assigning the best corner to him.It had little to do with Ben's injury he didn't hurt his arm

tburg68
03-11-2012, 03:20 PM
How is it too early in BROWN'S career to call HOLMES the most talented WR in Steelers History? History does change, it's implied that I was talking up to this point. I don't have a Delorian with a Flux Capacitor, so that's all I can go by.

Talent doesn't necessarily equal production. I said talent.

NHSteeler
03-11-2012, 04:13 PM
If you've only seen Ward make one "wow" catch you're either blinded by your hate and bias towards Hines or you haven't watched many games

Thank you.

K Train must have started watching the Steelers a year or two ago.

Danger DANJ
03-11-2012, 06:40 PM
They compliment each other because the secondary can't double everyone. With Wallace's speed, you have to double him which makes getting open easeir for Brown and Sanders, etc. Brown is good and Sanders has shown potential, but I wonder how well Brown would facing double coverage every week.

I'm with you. I do like Brown a little more than Wallace, but I'm not so sure Brown would be playing so well if Wallace wasn't drawing double coverage on a constant basis.


It is too early in brown's career to call Holmes the most talented of all time.plus you can have all the talent in the world if you smoke it all away it doesn't matter let's face it without an elite QB Holmes has been pedestrian at best.

Wallace's drop in production had to do with teams doubling him or assigning the best corner to him.It had little to do with Ben's injury he didn't hurt his arm

There may not have been anything wrong with Ben's arm, but with his ankle, he couldn't step into his throws. I recall more than a few times, right after he injured his ankle, he underthrew Wallace pretty badly. After that it seemed like they stopped calling any deep throws to Wallace. Whether it was because they wanted Ben to get rid of the ball quicker since he wasn't as mobile or because he just couldn't throw deep, it caused Wallace's production to suffer.

I do not want to see Wallace go, but if he did, I'd want an early first round pick as compensation so we can get Poe. To me, that's the only way it would be worth losing Wallace.

Stairwayto7
03-12-2012, 08:23 AM
Brown!
First I think Brown is more versatile and not afraid to go across the middle. My fear is without Wallace he will become less effective, I hope not. As fas as Sanders goes, until he can prove that he is reliable and not injury prone, he hasn`t shown enough yet. I would sign Cotchery ASAP.

Wallace will get some looks in FA but i`m not so sure everyone will be willing to give up a 1st round pick for him. At first glance he wasnt one of the top 3 free agents at wr. If we could get a top 20 pick, great. If it were NE 31 pick, I say sign him for whatever they offer him. They won`t have much cap space either, so we`ll see

K Train
03-12-2012, 10:58 AM
Thank you.

K Train must have started watching the Steelers a year or two ago.

lol right, yeah ward was pretty much = to randy moss the last 14 yearsrolleyes: . he made as many wow catches as he did burn the defense deep, probably a handful. He was a guy that was beyond clutch on 3rd down and found soft spots in zones masterfully, sure hes made deangeolo hall and even champ bailey look foolish on occasion, but to say hes a wowing type of WR is just wrong

connecticutsteel
03-12-2012, 11:00 AM
I understand your points...but production falls off when you're one dimensional.....

Not true at all production falls off double cover you of game plan for you and take the focus off of Antonio Brown.Wallace didn't suddenly become less talented.Wallace is not one dimentional.He's atalented reciever you don't post back to back 1000 yrd seasons cause your one dimentional

connecticutsteel
03-12-2012, 11:04 AM
I'm with you. I do like Brown a little more than Wallace, but I'm not so sure Brown would be playing so well if Wallace wasn't drawing double coverage on a constant basis.



There may not have been anything wrong with Ben's arm, but with his ankle, he couldn't step into his throws. I recall more than a few times, right after he injured his ankle, he underthrew Wallace pretty badly. After that it seemed like they stopped calling any deep throws to Wallace. Whether it was because they wanted Ben to get rid of the ball quicker since he wasn't as mobile or because he just couldn't throw deep, it caused Wallace's production to suffer.

I do not want to see Wallace go, but if he did, I'd want an early first round pick as compensation so we can get Poe. To me, that's the only way it would be worth losing Wallace.

Wallace should know ben's range and not just bolt down the field he has to comunicate with ben instead of running 60yrds and have the ball underthrown plus if ben can 't make the throw he shouldn't have played

coldrolled
03-12-2012, 11:19 AM
BA is gone its a new year.

Real Deal Steel
03-12-2012, 11:26 AM
Based soley on what we saw the last two years, Brown is the more complete WR. Not saying that Wallace is bad or that Wallace can't improve. But just on the last two years, Brown has proven to be the better route runner and able to go across the middle.

LatrobePA
03-12-2012, 11:35 AM
All this Hines talk is silly, he's done and has been for the last 2 seasons! He stopped blocking which was really the only thing he had going for him.. Making a few key catches here and there did nothing for me!! He should of been right right after DWTS!!

Move on!!

Real Deal Steel
03-12-2012, 11:38 AM
No need to talk about someone not on the roster anymore.

LatrobePA
03-12-2012, 12:02 PM
No need to talk about someone not on the roster anymore.

Exactly! There are some fans having a tough time letting go!!