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connecticutsteel
10-15-2011, 02:30 PM
Ike Taylor 481 tackles 99 passes defended 11 int'S in 125 games
asomugha 310 tackles 54 passes defended 11 int's in 122 games
in the last 4 seasons asomugha has been targeted 38,32,25 and 31 times
taylor 4 are 111,87,94 and 85

Deviouz1
10-15-2011, 03:45 PM
Ike Taylor 481 tackles 99 passes defended 11 int'S in 125 games
asomugha 310 tackles 54 passes defended 11 int's in 122 games
in the last 4 seasons asomugha has been targeted 38,32,25 and 31 times
taylor 4 are 111,87,94 and 85 Ranking him #1 ALL 4 YEARS

erm... no.

youve got that backwards. think about it. lets lump these stats together for ease of use

asmougha 126 targets = 11 ints, 54 pdef
taylor 377 targets = 11 ints, 99 pdef

asmougha
int = 8.73% chance per target
pdef = 42.85% per target

taylor
int =2.91% per target
pdef =26.25% per target.

which is exactly why he gets targeted more. as for the tackles, well, one should expect that if you get more targets and have a lower pdef/int% rate that you would get a much higher # of tackles.

i would trade taylor for namdi in half a heartbeat.

SnakeEyes43
10-15-2011, 03:57 PM
I wouldn't trade Taylor for any CB in the game right now.

Rampage
10-15-2011, 04:02 PM
I wouldn't trade Taylor for any CB in the game right now.

The way he is playing right now, I'd have a hard time believing you could find a better value. Asomugha (when in the right system) and Revis are definitely 1A and 1B right now, but with Taylor's recent performance and comparatively low salary, he's tough to beat.

Nolrog
10-15-2011, 04:31 PM
Ignoring the salary, I'd take Revis or Nnamdi, but when you factor in the salary, we're actually getting really good value for Ike.

Factoring in other things, such as Revis' penchant for hold outs (held out twice already, and rumors around these parts (if you recall, I work less than 5 miles from the Jets training complex) is that he's ready to do so again.)

Right now, I'm happy with the job Ike has done, and happy with our DBs overall so far this year.

BlitzburghRockCity
10-15-2011, 05:03 PM
The problem with Nnamdi right now is that he's in a system that is unlike what he is used too. It's going to take time for him to get acclimated to the Eagles style of defense. The Raiders would just let him take a receiver and effectively shut down one side of the field. Now he's asked to play zone, man to man, play run support, and what have you. It's not that he can't do it, but rather the adjustment period is longer than what the Eagles probably realized. Couple that with the fact that Eagles just suck right now and everyone is going after not only Nnamdi but everyone else. They don't scare anybody right now, not even with that secondary.

Ike is playing absolute lights out this year. It would be nice to see him make more INT's but it's not the end of the world. Lebeau is really letting him just be on his own. In face in one of his recent Ike Taylor shows on the Trib, he talked about how much he loves the challenge of man to man. Lebeau said he lobbies to play more of it and be left alone in the game.

Steelers_All_Day_43
10-15-2011, 05:38 PM
RIGHT NOW I'd rather have Taylor over Nnamdi. Nnamdi is the better player though

Deviouz1
10-15-2011, 06:24 PM
all i know is that the numbers dont lie. namdi IS the better player, there is no doubt about that. BRC hit on the specifics about time to adjust to a new system, this is the case with any player that goes to a new team that does things differently. i look to see namdi steadily increase his performance throughout the year and next year be just fine. taylor on the other hand most likely will not get any better than he is now.

my only real hope is that the younger guys overachieve this year and manage to become respectable CB's. im amazed how everyone is talking about how well theyre doing, deep down you all know that theyve "performed well" because everyone was running all over us and didnt need to use the passing game nearly as much.

we'll see how well they perform vs brady. if the pats dont eat us alive like they usually do then i may change my tune, but as it stands i just dont see it happening. optimism is good to a point, but not when it breeds over confidence. had manning been in the colts game i am sure things would have been much different, we would likely be sitting at 2-3 right now and its doubtful we'd be so high in the pass def ranks.

think about the QB's we've faced so far.

flacco - 170ish yds rushing
tavaris jackson - expected outcome
collins/painter - 153 yds passing from their 2nd and 3rd stringers
schaub - 155 yds rushing
hasselbeck - 260+ yds

none of these people are even close to considered "elite". 260+ from hasselbeck? really? and people are raving about how awesome our pass defense is?

we'll see.

Speeed
10-15-2011, 07:02 PM
I don't think they are raving, I think most are surprised at the low number. I have heard mention, but nobody is shouting from a mountain top. As you said, the numbers do not lie; the Steelers apparently have the 4th best pass defense in the league.

I would rather be first, but I will take 4th!


all i know is that the numbers dont lie. namdi IS the better player, there is no doubt about that. BRC hit on the specifics about time to adjust to a new system, this is the case with any player that goes to a new team that does things differently. i look to see namdi steadily increase his performance throughout the year and next year be just fine. taylor on the other hand most likely will not get any better than he is now.

my only real hope is that the younger guys overachieve this year and manage to become respectable CB's. im amazed how everyone is talking about how well theyre doing, deep down you all know that theyve "performed well" because everyone was running all over us and didnt need to use the passing game nearly as much.

we'll see how well they perform vs brady. if the pats dont eat us alive like they usually do then i may change my tune, but as it stands i just dont see it happening. optimism is good to a point, but not when it breeds over confidence. had manning been in the colts game i am sure things would have been much different, we would likely be sitting at 2-3 right now and its doubtful we'd be so high in the pass def ranks.

think about the QB's we've faced so far.

flacco - 170ish yds rushing
tavaris jackson - expected outcome
collins/painter - 153 yds passing from their 2nd and 3rd stringers
schaub - 155 yds rushing
hasselbeck - 260+ yds

none of these people are even close to considered "elite". 260+ from hasselbeck? really? and people are raving about how awesome our pass defense is?

we'll see.

cmerrifield
10-16-2011, 12:10 AM
think about the QB's we've faced so far.

flacco - 170ish yds rushing
tavaris jackson - expected outcome
collins/painter - 153 yds passing from their 2nd and 3rd stringers
schaub - 155 yds rushing
hasselbeck - 260+ yds

none of these people are even close to considered "elite". 260+ from hasselbeck? really? and people are raving about how awesome our pass defense is?

we'll see.

260+ in a game that was clearly over. I dont care if they give up 400+ yards as long as the score is what the Titans score was.

Deviouz1
10-16-2011, 12:28 AM
again, when brady faces them we'll see.

Diehardsteel
10-16-2011, 01:00 AM
i would trade taylor for namdi in half a heartbeat.

I love Ike but i'd trade him for Asomugha any day. Asomugha's damn near a blanket when in the right system. He's always struck me as a "Steelers" type player if there is such a thing. A very smart, talented, and tough football player. That being said Ike's no slouch either. I just wish he could catch the damn ball! Other than that he's pretty damn solid.

connecticutsteel
10-16-2011, 09:40 AM
erm... no.

youve got that backwards. think about it. lets lump these stats together for ease of use

asmougha 126 targets = 11 ints, 54 pdef
taylor 377 targets = 11 ints, 99 pdef

asmougha
int = 8.73% chance per target
pdef = 42.85% per target

taylor
int =2.91% per target
pdef =26.25% per target.

which is exactly why he gets targeted more. as for the tackles, well, one should expect that if you get more targets and have a lower pdef/int% rate that you would get a much higher # of tackles.

i would trade taylor for namdi in half a heartbeat.IM GLAD YOUR NOT RUNNINGTHE STEELERS ! PLUS theeaiders play in the west the steelers play tougher qb and recievers nnamdi sucks this year he's a pussy he has alot of excuses this year well i'm not used to playing zone balh blah blah zone is easier than man but he can't play zone? taylor 2 rings namdi never played on a winning team

coldrolled
10-16-2011, 10:00 AM
nnamdi doesnt suck... its the defensive coordinator that is going to be fired.. castillo is his name i think.... he is about as good as our BA...

he makes great talent look bad...

keep taylor cut mcfadden and sign nnamdi..

go steelers.

Callax
10-16-2011, 10:12 AM
Ike looks like one of the best CB's in the league right now....
The first few games, he was the only one not playing like slow OLD men....
I'm glad he's still wearing black and gold...
FYI Gay is not playing badly either, must be a contract year.
Lewis is playing too far off the wr, he needs to stop playing 10 yards off, play 5-7 and he'll do better

connecticutsteel
10-16-2011, 10:17 AM
you have your opinion i have mine but it's funny the minute he plays for a better team he has an off year the position isn't that different on any defense namdi was good until 2009 his performance has dropped off the last two years ike hasn't

--- Added 10/16/2011 at 08:17 AM ---


Ike looks like one of the best CB's in the league right now....
The first few games, he was the only one not playing like slow OLD men....
I'm glad he's still wearing black and gold...
FYI Gay is not playing badly either, must be a contract year.
Lewis is playing too far off the wr, he needs to stop playing 10 yards off, play 5-7 and he'll do better

he plays off cause it's not a man to man scheme its zone the idea of zone is bend don't break keep everything in front and safety help over the top

Deviouz1
10-16-2011, 12:27 PM
IM GLAD YOUR NOT RUNNINGTHE STEELERS ! PLUS theeaiders play in the west the steelers play tougher qb and recievers nnamdi sucks this year he's a pussy he has alot of excuses this year well i'm not used to playing zone balh blah blah zone is easier than man but he can't play zone? taylor 2 rings namdi never played on a winning team

and im glad YOURE not in charge of the steelers or we would be chock full of second rate players. there is no pitt oppenent in the AFCN that has a better QB/WR team than rivers/jackson. one of the diffrences between taylor namdi is that namdi was the sole bright spot on the raiders D. taylor is surrounded by one of the best Ds in football year in and year out which is the ONLY reason he has ANY rings. were taylor on the raiders ... lets just say "bright spot" isnt the term i would use. as far as zone v man coverage, zone requires awareness of everything in your zone. man requires awareness of one guy and a much higher level of athleticism.

im sorry man, but if you seriously cant see that namdi is the superior CB then youre quite simply naive.

SnakeEyes43
10-16-2011, 01:30 PM
keep taylor cut mcfadden and sign nnamdi..
go steelers.

Haha, that would be too awesome to ever happen.

BlitzburghRockCity
10-16-2011, 05:48 PM
Ike Taylor is indeed human after all. Today was not one of his better days. That play in the first half that Gabbert overthrew Dillard, if that were any experienced NFL QB it would have been a touchdown. Then Gabbert hit Hill who again had a couple steps on a trailing Ike Taylor.

Overall it ended up not costing them the game, but this was the first week that Ike really wasn't on the money.

Iron Paul
10-16-2011, 06:44 PM
I wouldn't trade Taylor for any CB in the game right now.
Taylor unfortunately got smoked on that touchdown by the Jags.

BlitzburghRockCity
10-16-2011, 09:47 PM
Ike was bound to have an off game. His off games though are generally better than most CB's in the NFL, even our own roster. Taylor will bounce back next week, I'm sure he'll work extra hard this week and put this one behind him.

Deviouz1
10-17-2011, 12:06 AM
believe it or not, i do hope youre right. i know i dont sound like it sometimes but i really hope they can pull things together. ive said it before, Ike isnt a BAD CB, i just dont think he's as good as a lot of people seem to think. and we need to win. yes i did say "need". i know its a bit early for that kind of statement but with the flat play of late against some , lets face it, less than stellar teams...

i have to admit, the NE game, and brady in particular, terrifies me. if the secondary can even keep that game close i will feel better about things. i guess ive just seen us get so badly burned so many times by the likes of brady and manning especially in the playoffs and more specifically in the AFC champ game, that im a little gun shy about it. if we cant keep it close against teams like them then, barring some kind of miracle, we really have no chance to get back to the big one.

uclkyle
10-17-2011, 01:37 AM
I'd take Revis over Ike.....not NA.

jwmann2
10-17-2011, 08:37 PM
Ike Taylor gets balls throw his way more often. These stats are very misleading. Not sayig Ike Taylor isn't an elite CB because he def is.

connecticutsteel
10-17-2011, 09:59 PM
again, when brady faces them we'll see.
ok brady fanboy

coldrolled
10-18-2011, 09:28 AM
ok brady fanboy

Its not the players who need to step up with NE its our defensive game plan.

we try to stop the big plays... which we do. but brady is a champion at first downs with 2 yard pass plays and yards after catch.. our CB's are usually 10+ yards off the line..

if we dont change that game plan. we will lose.

Or ben will need to keep up with brady and the last team with the balll wins.
But if we put goose eggs up in any qtr.. which is an arians trademark.. we will lose.

We need to have a special NE game plan ready on offense and defense to beat these rivals.

i still cant believe brady and this offense plays the same game week in week out. And no DC has figured out how to stop them.. its really been years of the same offense...
they are actually boring to watch... its timed like a monkey in a cage.. back and forth, up and down.. no one can stop them..

Deviouz1
10-18-2011, 01:09 PM
ok brady fanboy

oh im sorry, am i supposed to say something like "Brady sucks"? :thinking:

he is arguably the best QB in the NFL, pardon me for being a realist rather than pulling the black and gold wool over my eyes like some others i could mention.

blind faith is NOT a virtue. nor is discounting your opponents abilities. especially when that same opponent has made you look silly about 90% of the times youve faced them. no, wait, its actually 85.71%. the brady led pats have beaten the steelers 6 of the 7 times theyve played, two of which were AFC champ games and the only time we've beaten the pats with brady in the game was back in 04.

feel free to close your eyes, stick your fingers in your ears and "LALALALALA" all you want. it doesnt change a damn thing. when brady comes to town, the steelers would do well to remember history rather than ignore it.

connecticutsteel
10-18-2011, 08:48 PM
oh im sorry, am i supposed to say something like "Brady sucks"? :thinking:

he is arguably the best QB in the NFL, pardon me for being a realist rather than pulling the black and gold wool over my eyes like some others i could mention.

blind faith is NOT a virtue. nor is discounting your opponents abilities. especially when that same opponent has made you look silly about 90% of the times youve faced them. no, wait, its actually 85.71%. the brady led pats have beaten the steelers 6 of the 7 times theyve played, two of which were AFC champ games and the only time we've beaten the pats with brady in the game was back in 04.

feel free to close your eyes, stick your fingers in your ears and "LALALALALA" all you want. it doesnt change a damn thing. when brady comes to town, the steelers would do well to remember history rather than ignore it.no your not suppose to say brady sucks cause he doesn't but as a Steelers fan remain optomistic even when it doesn't look good it's called routing for your favorite team back when were cheating they beat us but let me guess you don't think they cheated?I'm sorry i live in New England and all i hear is how great Brady is but he has lost in the playoffs 4 years running. So excuse me if i don't want to hear how great Brady is in a Steelers forum .

Deviouz1
10-18-2011, 09:08 PM
no your not suppose to say brady sucks cause he doesn't but as a Steelers fan we sould remain optomistic even when it doesn't look good it's called routing for your favorite team back when were cheating yhey beat us but let me guess you don't think they cheated?

"back when they were cheating"? LOL yeah, thats how they beat us. didnt have ANYthing to do with brady's precision, didnt have ANYthing to do with our secondary leaking like a sieve, nor had it anything to do with not being able to get to the QB. its because they cheated. obviously.

you can root for your team without being optimistic. you dont have to think your team is going to win to hope they will and you dont have to completely ignore all evidence to the contrary. is it possible the steelers win? sure, if we can keep brady on his *** and force turnovers then most assuredly. but not only do we usually have a problem with that vs the pats, this year we can barely get a turnover vs ANYone, so unless something drastic happens i just dont see it as very likely.


[ninja edit]I'm sorry i live in New England and all i hear is how great Brady is but he has lost in the playoffs 4 years running. So excuse me if i don't want to hear how great Brady is in a Steelers forum .

ha can afford to lose in the playoffs for 4 years running. he's got 3 rings. as for what you do and dont want to hear, that really isnt my concern. i couldnt care less what you want to hear. i neither require nor desire your approval. im a realist. i call it as i see it. period. if you dont like it, too bad. i have a feeling youll (eventually) get over it.

connecticutsteel
10-19-2011, 02:15 AM
as do i fan boy

Deviouz1
10-19-2011, 02:44 AM
im not a fan boy twit, brady is a prissy bitch and i hope he gets hammered on every play. but that doesnt change the fact that he's fng dangerous with a football. im sorry if it bothers you that i am capable of respecting the skill of an opponent without liking them in the least. the only teams i like less than the pats are dallas and baltimore. why is this concept so hard to get through your skull?

coldrolled
10-19-2011, 05:24 AM
this is the taylor vs namdi thread...

but really more like Arians vs Belicheat .. Not sure of Arians record against Belecheat but it isnt pretty.

If we would stay on the field and score more .... Brady would have to watch a lot more football. But Advantage Belecheat... he seems to keep us off the score board..

The only question is how can Belecheat really figure out Arians if we cant??

Belecheat must be a defensive genius... :-)