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View Full Version : Ben Not in Top 5 Accurate QBs 2011



RIVERS OF STEEL
08-22-2011, 01:30 PM
That's right. Why, because Ben is in a category all of his own. No other current QB is in this category. He can run, he can throw, he can block and he can tackle. How you gonna compare any other QB to that. He is also accurate. More than Vick (#5) I'd bet. Watchin latest release on these stats from ESPN. Just look at the top 5. It is Hollywood versus Homewood.

Numbers do not tell the true story.

Rampage
08-22-2011, 01:32 PM
It's because he isn't a fantasy football god. Let these other guys win fantasy championships; I'll take meaningful wins.

LatrobePA
08-22-2011, 01:35 PM
Who cares what they type..

harpo
08-22-2011, 01:50 PM
Who cares? As long as he's in the top 5 among the QBs with multiple Super Bowl wins, that's all that matters.

steelersbabex25
08-22-2011, 02:24 PM
Yeah. The Steelers suck, Ben sucks, Harrison is a killer :blah:

connecticutsteel
08-22-2011, 09:52 PM
Let me first say that as a true sports fan i'm ashamed to say that ESPN was born in CONNECTICUT . they turned a great network into a joke that fabricates stories embelishes the facts and is centered around the shock value angle . therefore i pay little attention to this once great network and there cast of clowns

BlitzburghRockCity
08-22-2011, 10:30 PM
Ben is never going to be the Hollywood, NFL golden boy, Quarterback that the league wants to promote. He does things the down and dirty way, the old school way. He doesn't have the line that Manning or Brady has, he does it the old fashioned way and that's just right for us.

I've always said, if you put Manning or Brady or any other top QB in the league behind the Steelers offensive line over the last 5 years, there is no way they have the stats or championships that they do now.

MattyVfromCT
08-22-2011, 10:30 PM
Let me first say that as a true sports fan i'm ashamed to say that ESPN was born in CONNECTICUT . they turned a great network into a joke that fabricates stories embelishes the facts and is centered around the shock value angle . therefore i pay little attention to this once great network and there cast of clowns

COULDN'T AGREE WITH YOU MORE DUDE. ESPN went from being a legit sports news network to the national enquirer of sports journalism. That network is one steaming pile of ****. They are far more concerned with having stupid catchphrases (Stuart Scott especially) to cater to the younger generation. Its all flash and no substance. And the talking heads on nfl network aren't much better especially sanders, irvin and that windbag rich Eisen.

When it comes to these rankings I don't get too worked up. Usually I will for a second but then u actually look at these stupid lists and polls and 9 times out of 10 the results are a polarity contest and not based on actual performance. The top 100 players of 2011 show on ESPN was laughable. Ray lewis at number 4? LOL. Completely invalidated.

As far as ben, he doesn't get his due because of gay *** fantasy football. Im sorry I despise than nonsense. Im a defensive guy and that garbage is mostly predicated on offensive numbers. Yes I know there's leagues where you can draft defenses by individual player but even still. No interest at all whatsoever. I don't care what numbers Vick, matt Ryan, Phil rivers, etc put up, there is not a chance in hell they are better than #7. I'll take a winner over a stat guy who chokes in a big spot, and that goes for Peyton as well.....

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MattyVfromCT
08-22-2011, 10:37 PM
Ben is never going to be the Hollywood, NFL golden boy, Quarterback that the league wants to promote. He does things the down and dirty way, the old school way. He doesn't have the line that Manning or Brady has, he does it the old fashioned way and that's just right for us.

I've always said, if you put Manning or Brady or any other top QB in the league behind the Steelers offensive line over the last 5 years, there is no way they have the stats or championships that they do now.

That's exactly what I tell all these idiots I know who constantly go on about ben being "overrated" and "nowhere near brady or manning". The things i've actually heard people say are so stupid these people should have their heads examined. I've had colts fans tell me ben won Sb 43 because he had a great d, OLINE AND RUN GAME (both sucked miserably in 08) while Peyton pretty much singlehandedly won Sb 41 with a team that had no d, no run game and no oline. I **** you not. I don't even need to break this down, we all know how STUPID that statement is. All im gonna say is Peyton's super bowl mvp is the most undeserved mvp since Larry f'ing brown.....

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STEELyourface
08-22-2011, 11:04 PM
Let me first say that as a true sports fan i'm ashamed to say that ESPN was born in CONNECTICUT . they turned a great network into a joke that fabricates stories embelishes the facts and is centered around the shock value angle . therefore i pay little attention to this once great network and there cast of clowns

I have to agree with you, it pretty much sucks these days. It didn't used to be that way though, man. It used to be this awesomely entertaining independant station that did things there own way and was fun to watch.

I put it all on Disney/ABC. Ever since they bought ESPN it has steadily declined in quality. I REALLY think that is where it all went wrong. I don't think its a coincidence that they started sucking right around that time.

I think ESPN Radio still has some of that independant spirit that ESPN itself once posessed though. As for college football coverage, no one even comes close to ESPN's coverage so if you are a fan of NCAAF you are stuck with them.

BlacknGold Bleeder
08-22-2011, 11:12 PM
Don't matter what they or anybody writes, as long as he wins he's alright in my book !!:tt02::tt02::tt02:

STEELyourface
08-22-2011, 11:52 PM
Oh yeah, and as for Ben not being accurate, who cares?? He wins doesn't he?? I'll take the toughness and winning everyone else can have the QBs with good stats. They did the same thing to Terry Bradshaw during his playing career too. There is nothing sexy about the way he plays, just tough, gritty, and clutch. I'm fine with it, I could care less about those polls and stat

I believe Marc Bulger is the most accurate QB in NFL history (if he isn't he was at one point for a while). What does that tell you? Don't get me wrong, I love Bulger he went to WVU and is from the 'burgh but you get my point!

--- Added 8/22/2011 at 09:52 PM ---


Ben is never going to be the Hollywood, NFL golden boy, Quarterback that the league wants to promote. He does things the down and dirty way, the old school way. He doesn't have the line that Manning or Brady has, he does it the old fashioned way and that's just right for us.

I've always said, if you put Manning or Brady or any other top QB in the league behind the Steelers offensive line over the last 5 years, there is no way they have the stats or championships that they do now.

I know one thing;

give Brady, Brees, or Manning the same exact stat line as Ben in SB XLIII and that game winning drive and any of them would've been SB MVP. I'm not taking anything away from what Holmes did in that game but no one can honestly say those other guys would not have got that MVP 10 outta 10 times for the final drive alone.

Mr. Goosemahn
08-23-2011, 02:18 AM
Quite frankly, I don't think Ben is a top 5 accurate QB in this league. I know some people will try and crucify me for this, but he is definitely not on Brady's or Manning's level when it comes to accuracy.

My list would be Brady, Manning, Brees, Rivers, and Rodgers, in any order. Ben is not like those types of guys, and quite frankly I don't mind it that much. Ben is more than "accurate enough" to win games. It's more of a testament to how unnaturally accurate those guys are.

What Ben does for our team is bring a toughness that, out of those guys, only Rodgers brings. Furthermore, he is the best at buying himself time and making plays out of seemingly broken ones.

All in all, Ben isn't a top 5 accurate QB, but that doesn't matter. Best accuracy =/= best QB.

steelersgal86
08-23-2011, 07:37 AM
Don't matter what they or anybody writes, as long as he wins he's alright in my book !!:tt02::tt02::tt02:

exactly...he gets the job done...he fits in well with steeler style football...as long as we win who cares about the top 5 accurate QB's ... did they all make it to the super bowl :dunno:

coldrolled
08-23-2011, 08:36 AM
If he could sit patiently in the pocket like manning and brady, he would be top 5..

if manning and brady had to run for their lives every other play and take the hits ben does, they would be in the booth with bradshaw annoucing...

MattyVfromCT
08-23-2011, 08:38 AM
Quite frankly, I don't think Ben is a top 5 accurate QB in this league. I know some people will try and crucify me for this, but he is definitely not on Brady's or Manning's level when it comes to accuracy.

My list would be Brady, Manning, Brees, Rivers, and Rodgers, in any order. Ben is not like those types of guys, and quite frankly I don't mind it that much. Ben is more than "accurate enough" to win games. It's more of a testament to how unnaturally accurate those guys are.

What Ben does for our team is bring a toughness that, out of those guys, only Rodgers brings. Furthermore, he is the best at buying himself time and making plays out of seemingly broken ones.

All in all, Ben isn't a top 5 accurate QB, but that doesn't matter. Best accuracy =/= best QB.

Interesting. He's thrown 2 of the most accurate passes in pressure spots that I've ever seen, the td to Santonio in the super bowl and 3rd and 19 to brown against the rats. And as good as brady is how accurate do you have to be when 90% of the time you're throwing short slants, screens, etc and letting weaker and company gain most of the yardage after the catch? Just saying. As much as I hate Peyton he impresses me more as far as accuracy. I've seen some ridiculous downfield passes in really tight spots. And im sorry, I don't care what anyone says. Phil rivers is ridiculously overrated. Fantasy stats don't make a champion.....

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Zachintosh66
08-23-2011, 10:48 AM
who cares, not important... W.hats I.portant N.ow

Scorp
08-23-2011, 01:29 PM
All i know is Ben is going to show everyone why he is better than a top 5 qb. Ya'll who posted before me already said it all. They'll be talking about Ben when he's doing outstanding things, like always, on the field.

LarryNJ
08-23-2011, 01:45 PM
I didn't see the numbers for accuracy. Are you talking about ESPN's new Total QB Rating?

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6833215/explaining-statistics-total-quarterback-rating

connecticutsteel
08-23-2011, 06:39 PM
I'll take real wins over fantasy ones any day . If ryan ,brady, the mannings,brees orrivers had ben's o-line they would be lucky to be alive let alone have a winning record soi'll take ben anyday allday

BlitzburghRockCity
08-23-2011, 06:42 PM
The Steelers don't concern themselves with fantasy rankings or what their QB ranks are by somebody's scale. They care about winning, whether it's ugly or pretty, whether it's by 1 or 30, a win is a win. As long as they keep winning they'll be quite happy...as will Big Ben.

Besides those ranking that Larry posted up include rushing stats as well. Either way it's all just another topic for Steeler fans to laugh about and other teams fans to base their lives on.

andyg1984
08-23-2011, 08:50 PM
to a certain extent this is one of those things where it is like ... does the top 5 really matter? the first tier should have Brady, Rodgers, Rivers, Manning, Ben and Brees ... to try and separate them really comes down to style points .. so for me you need a top 6 here in this specific case ... kind of like how most would say there are 3 top WRs in the league (AJ, Fitz, Megatron) and then you move onto the 2nd tier ...

Mr. Goosemahn
08-24-2011, 03:12 AM
Interesting. He's thrown 2 of the most accurate passes in pressure spots that I've ever seen, the td to Santonio in the super bowl and 3rd and 19 to brown against the rats.

:S

Really? That's what you're basing Ben's accuracy on, on just two successful throws? I know they were great, but they hardly encompass his abilities as a passer.

Furthermore, I never said Ben was an inaccurate QB, you completely misread my post.


Ben is more than "accurate enough" to win games. It's more of a testament to how unnaturally accurate those guys are.

But I'll stand by what I said. All those guys are IMO more accurate than Roethlisberger.


And as good as brady is how accurate do you have to be when 90% of the time you're throwing short slants, screens, etc and letting weaker and company gain most of the yardage after the catch? Just saying.

In the Patriots' offense? Very, very, very accurate. Their offense relies on accuracy and timing, if nothing else. By your logic, it's the WR's who make Brady well, Brady. In real life, Brady is the guy who makes WRs look fantastic. Just look at basically all his receivers after they leave NE. It's Brady's skills that allow receivers to succeed.


And im sorry, I don't care what anyone says. Phil rivers is ridiculously overrated. Fantasy stats don't make a champion.....

Hardly. If anything, Rivers is underrated. He has a horrible throwing motion, as he appears to heave the ball into the air rather than gracefully throw it, but the touch he puts on passes is unmatched in the league. I know people love to measure a QB's success by his playoff record, but that isn't nearly as important when measuring what we're measuring here: accuracy. Rivers is supremely accurate and while he does accumulate a ridiculous amount of stats, that most certainly doesn't mean he's not a great QB. In fact, in a traditional QB sense, he's better than Roethlisberger. And I have no problem with it.

People are looking way too much into this "Roethlisberger isn't top 5 in accuracy." Who effin cares if he's not top 5 in that list, he's top 5 in plenty others. He's top 5 in toughest to tackle, he's top 5 in clutch, he's top 5 in extending plays, he's top 5 in yards per attempt, he's top 5 in "will to win," he's top 5 in playoff performance, etc., etc., etc.

I know there are plenty of guys out there who love Roethlisberger, and believe me when I say I'm one of them, but I'm not going to go "rah rah Roethlisberger is elite in all categories and he's better than everybody else!" Just like any other player in the league, Roethlisberger has flaws, one being that his accuracy is not elite, like it is for other guys.

Black@Gold Forever32
08-24-2011, 03:20 AM
Its easier to be accurate to when you play your home games in domes like Manning/Brees.......Yes I know Lucas Oil Field in Indy is retractable but they keep that dome close most of the time.....As for Rivers he plays his home games in sunny San Diego......Were Ben plays his home games in the elements and the weather is usually crappy in the late months of the season in Pittsburgh.......

I think there is times were Ben is really damn accurate.....When he is fully healthy and has time in the pocket he can make some pretty sick accurate throws......Now at times Ben has his moments were his accuracy is inconsistent......Many factors can contribute to that......weather, coming off injury or battling his various injuries, being rushed in the pocket......

MattyVfromCT
08-24-2011, 08:14 AM
Its easier to be accurate to when you play your home games in domes like Manning/Brees.......Yes I know Lucas Oil Field in Indy is retractable but they keep that dome close most of the time.....As for Rivers he plays his home games in sunny San Diego......Were Ben plays his home games in the elements and the weather is usually crappy in the late months of the season in Pittsburgh.......

I think there is times were Ben is really damn accurate.....When he is fully healthy and has time in the pocket he can make some pretty sick accurate throws......Now at times Ben has his moments were his accuracy is inconsistent......Many factors can contribute to that......weather, coming off injury or battling his various injuries, being rushed in the pocket......

My thoughts exactly. Give ben new england or Indy's online and give all the golden boy media darlings everything ben has to deal with. Our swiss cheese oline, our weather (brady and rodgers get a pass), and one factor that I think really gets overlooked is our field conditions. We have by far the worst playing surface in the league, especially late in the year and combined with the nasty weather, it makes it much harder for our already bad line to get their feet set as well as our receivers to get open. All the dome boys and rivers don't have to deal with that. And while brady plays in the new england winter weather, let's remember, Gillette stadium is field turfs, not grass. Not saying ben is perfect but he's underrated accuracy wise among other things. And as far as im concerned there is nobody in the league as accurate on the run as ben....

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LarryNJ
08-24-2011, 10:30 AM
The Steelers don't concern themselves with fantasy rankings or what their QB ranks are by somebody's scale. They care about winning, whether it's ugly or pretty, whether it's by 1 or 30, a win is a win. As long as they keep winning they'll be quite happy...as will Big Ben.

Besides those ranking that Larry posted up include rushing stats as well. Either way it's all just another topic for Steeler fans to laugh about and other teams fans to base their lives on.

They include a lot of other things too.


A quick primer on the fundamentals of Total Quarterback Rating:

Scoring: 0-100, from low to high. An average QB would be at 50.
Win Probability: All QB plays are scored based on how much they contribute to a win. By determining expected point totals for almost any situation, Total QBR is able to apply points to a quarterback based on every type of play he would be involved in.
Dividing Credit: Total QBR factors in such things as overthrows, underthrows, yards after the catch and more to accurately determine how much a QB contributes to each play.
Clutch Index: How critical a certain play is based on when it happens in a game is factored into the score.

Last year Brady's TQR was miles ahead of anyone's and Ben was in 10th place. I don't think that makes him the 10th best last year but they are interesting numbers.

TampaSteelGirl
08-24-2011, 12:29 PM
Let me first say that as a true sports fan i'm ashamed to say that ESPN was born in CONNECTICUT . they turned a great network into a joke that fabricates stories embelishes the facts and is centered around the shock value angle . therefore i pay little attention to this once great network and there cast of clowns

I agree here...I rarely watch unless there is a Steeler game on...

STEELyourface
08-24-2011, 03:27 PM
GOOSEMAHN- you got this one right, in my opinion. He just isn't one of the most accurate QBs in the league. Yes, there are a lot of adverse conditions that factor into this but bottom line is those other guys are more accurate. It's nothing to get worked up about. No one is saying he isn't good or for that matter that he isn't accurate he just isn't as accurate as the most accurate, no more no less. This is not a big deal at all and it is correct, who cares it doesn't take away either ring or make him not one of the best QBs in the league, its is an honest observation.

MATTYVFROMCT- ya our field sucks but don't forget about Soldier Field, I think theirs might be worse than ours. Ours is definitely the worst that one weekend of WPIAL Playoffs and Backyard Brawl in Pittsburgh followed by a Steeler home game but even that isn't every year. I never understood why they didn't make sure both the Steelers and Pitt play away from Heinz the weekend they have all those high school games there.