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View Full Version : Holmes trade could be worst ever



Steel Trap86
11-22-2010, 01:56 AM
Holmes had another 2 TD's today, one in the last 10 seconds to win the game. This is the fourth week in a row he has won the game in the 4th quarter for the Jets. Yes I know he might not have resigned anyway and we had to make an example out of him blah blah blah all that **** the Rooneys told everybody, but a 5th round pick for Holmes?? This guy is in his prime right now. 2008 playoffs and the Superbowl would be the strongest examples of what he can do, and that's big plays in big games...on top of that he was a Raven killer. No disrespect to Wallace, because he has been killing it this year.
Our 5th round picks were Scott, Butler and Sylvester btw

I'm trying to think which move was worse, Steelers trading Holmes to the Jets for a 5th rounder or the Dolphins trading Welker to the Patriots for a 2nd


290

DanRooney
11-22-2010, 02:22 AM
Wallace's pace for 1200 yards in his second year kind of lessens the pain. It took Holmes 4 years to do that. But I agree, a downright assaholic move trading him for a 5th round draft pick. Especially considering we gave away our 4th for absolutely nothing.

Real Deal Steel
11-22-2010, 03:14 AM
I've seen "supposed" great teams like the Jets do this before. And teams like that won't be around when the smoke clears. You can't keep flirting with losses every week. It will catch up to them. No worries.

steelersbabex25
11-22-2010, 04:50 AM
I hate it. A recieving corp with Ward, Holmes, and Wallace? Can't belive that opportunity got away from us.

Nolrog
11-22-2010, 07:43 AM
I'm trying to think which move was worse, Steelers trading Holmes to the Jets for a 5th rounder or the Dolphins trading Welker to the Patriots for a 2nd

The worst trade ever? Oh please. The Holmes deal is probably not even in the top 10.

The worst deal every was the Herschel Walker deal although the Elway deal dang close.

Here's a list by ESPN (includes all sports.)

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/list/trades/010716.html

DBR96A
11-22-2010, 08:11 AM
This won't be "the worst trade ever" once Santonio Holmes fails another **** test and gets suspended for an entire season.

coldrolled
11-22-2010, 08:25 AM
it was knee jerk... a 2nd round would have made some sense. or trade him after the 4 week suspension like the Moss deal to a team in need during season.

Steel Trap86
11-22-2010, 08:33 AM
The worst trade ever? Oh please. The Holmes deal is probably not even in the top 10.

The worst deal every was the Herschel Walker deal although the Elway deal dang close.

Here's a list by ESPN (includes all sports.)

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/list/trades/010716.html

Read your own link, those are all ranked based on the players impact with his new team. Holmes hasn't even played a full year and we're now starting to see the chemistry built with Sanchez and he's tearing **** up while being targeted twice as much now. He's a closer, plain and simple. He closes games out and any Steeler fan knows it. Holmes shines in the playoffs and I think this is just the beginning for him.

DBR96A
11-22-2010, 08:41 AM
Santonio Holmes gets to wear his favorite color now: GREEN.

Steel Trap86
11-22-2010, 09:05 AM
Santonio Holmes gets to wear his favorite color now: GREEN.

Congratulations man that is the lamest **** I've heard in about 2 years lol almost as bad as "Rapistburger"

Nolrog
11-22-2010, 09:11 AM
Read your own link, those are all ranked based on the players impact with his new team. Holmes hasn't even played a full year and we're now starting to see the chemistry built with Sanchez and he's tearing **** up while being targeted twice as much now. He's a closer, plain and simple. He closes games out and any Steeler fan knows it. Holmes shines in the playoffs and I think this is just the beginning for him.

No matter how you slice it, The Holmes deal couldn't out rank those two. Dallas built a dynasty largely on the basis of that one deal and Elway took Denver to the SB 5 times. Those are high hurdles for the Holmes deal to clear.

LarryNJ
11-22-2010, 09:12 AM
The worst trade ever? Oh please.
:plus1: It certainly wasn't the smartest move in history but far from the worst ever.

greg1964
11-22-2010, 09:17 AM
Ward, Holmes, Wallace is way better, than Ward, Wallace, El or Sander or Brown. But considering Holmes has a drug problem, and he would have missed the first four games because of it; he said that he wasn't going to resign with the Steelers, and one more mis-step drug wise he would be lost for a YEAR, the Steelers got what they could and moved on. Besides cutting Holmes only hurt the Steelers this year. I believe Wallace, Sanders Ward and Brown is going to be was explosive as any WR group in the NFL. With the starters be Wallace and Sanders as early was next year. Ward will go down as one of the greatest Steelers ever, but as far a receiving goes he has become the third down guy that works best out of the slot. And if the Steelers passing game is design for longer routes I would perfer to see Ward and Millers work the middle of the field and Wallace, Sanders and Brown work the longer routes and slant, because if either make someone miss a tackle, no one is going to catch them.

BlitzburghRockCity
11-22-2010, 09:26 AM
Not even close to the worst trade ever. It wasn't the smartest move by this team from a competitve standpoint, I'd certainly agree with that. Overall though I'd say we have a pretty competent receiving corp now. I'm quite happy with Ward and Wallace starting and now with Brown & Sanders getting more time.

If Holmes had been there we might not see the growth and development of our 2 rookie WR's so soon. The main reason I wanted to really see Holmes stick around is because Ward is getting older now and none of us were certain yet that Wallace was the real the deal and none of us knew if the rookies would be able to step up this year as well as they have.

Ward has been playing well like always, been pretty healthy, and our guys are stepping up to the challenge.

madtowndrunkard
11-22-2010, 10:48 AM
It was a horrible trade if you look at just the surface. Problem is we didn't really have a choice. No one wanted him. If the best offer you get is a 5th round pick what can you do? If the Steelers ownership wanted to send a message there was no other way to do it. We clearly decided to trade or cut him. If we just cut him we risked the chance of him going to an AFC north team.

The only other option the Steelers had was to keep him. Then we were going to deal with the drama and distractions of his 4 game suspension along with Ben's. I think a better message might have been to keep him, then deactivate him the entire year...But imagine the drama that would have followed that move. Holmes put the steelers in a no win position. His actions were a bigger problem then we realized. The steelers just did a good job of keeping it under raps. The Rooney's didn't want to sit and watch one of theirs self destruct and take the team down with him. We had a plan B. So it was a move that had to be made.

igor0190
11-22-2010, 10:50 AM
Jets gave a 5th round pick and got Santonio for 12 games. That's what it breaks down to right now. Anything else is unknown. He is a FA at the end of the year and will be demanding top dollar which the Steelers wouldn't have paid him. (See Plaxico Burress and see how that turned out). We got NOTHING for Plax. Not even a 5th.

What you really gonna do if a guy doesn't want to play for the Steelers?? For that reason I hope Holmes and the Jets fail.

Troyisabeast_43
11-22-2010, 11:33 AM
I've seen "supposed" great teams like the Jets do this before. And teams like that won't be around when the smoke clears. You can't keep flirting with losses every week. It will catch up to them. No worries.

Hopefully it catches up to them on December 19th when the Jets visit Heinz Field. I agree that the Jets might be able to make comebacks against sub-par teams like the Lions,Browns and Texans but they will not be able to do that against the likes of the Patriots and the Steelers two teams they still have to face on the road.

Rampage
11-22-2010, 11:34 AM
I disagree that the Holmes trade was the worst ever. Sure, he is a great receiver; however, I think the Rooneys got fed up with his off the field antics, especially when Roethlisberger brought so much off season attention. Holmes had even stated that he was probably going to leave after this season, so at least this team got something back. It would have been nice to see Holmes shape up and stay, but I do not think this team is hurting too bad with his departure.

Clevelandsux
11-22-2010, 12:17 PM
Look guys, Holmes wore out his welcome in Pittsburgh. Oh yes, he's doing good. But how long will it be until he gets suspended again. You know Pittsburgh doesn't tolerate that b.s. Enough about Holmes!

Nolrog
11-22-2010, 06:31 PM
Look guys, Holmes wore out his welcome in Pittsburgh. Oh yes, he's doing good. But how long will it be until he gets suspended again. You know Pittsburgh doesn't tolerate that b.s. Enough about Holmes!

I think his next suspension is for a full year, isn't it? That would be his 3rd if he fails another test.

K Train
11-22-2010, 06:45 PM
Look guys, Holmes wore out his welcome in Pittsburgh. Oh yes, he's doing good. But how long will it be until he gets suspended again. You know Pittsburgh doesn't tolerate that b.s. Enough about Holmes!

ben was accused of sexual assault multiple times and harrison beat on his gf a few times.

holmes.....smoked weed? lol

pittsburgh does tolerate bad behavior....i love how everything thinks that being a steeler=being a choir boy

steelersbabex25
11-22-2010, 06:48 PM
ben was accused of sexual assault multiple times and harrison beat on his gf a few times.

holmes.....smoked weed? lol

pittsburgh does tolerate bad behavior....i love how everything thinks that being a steeler=being a choir boy

True. The Steelers tolerate all kinds of bad behavoir. I don't know why Holmes had to be the one to take the fall. IMO he was almost as important as Roethlisberger to that offense, and they didn't get rid of Roethlisberger when he was initially given a 6 game suspension.

Rampage
11-22-2010, 07:10 PM
True. The Steelers tolerate all kinds of bad behavoir. I don't know why Holmes had to be the one to take the fall. IMO he was almost as important as Roethlisberger to that offense, and they didn't get rid of Roethlisberger when he was initially given a 6 game suspension.

Its simple. The team couldn't afford to take any extra bad publicity and had to do something. Who is more important to the team, Roethlisberger or Holmes? Cut ties with Holmes to try to give the appearance that you won't put up with it and hold onto the player that will make a greater impact on the team. I would not mind having Holmes on the roster, but it is doubtful that he would have stayed after this season. Look at the bright side, Sanders and Brown are showing promise and Wallace is developing into a good receiver. Holmes would have been the cherry on top, but you can't have it all.

Steel Trap86
11-22-2010, 07:25 PM
ben was accused of sexual assault multiple times and harrison beat on his gf a few times.

holmes.....smoked weed? lol

pittsburgh does tolerate bad behavior....i love how everything thinks that being a steeler=being a choir boy

Bang on. lol and weed being the only potential setback for him is not as bad since he doesn't struggle on the field. He is a great route runner and we all know he can catch

It might not amount to the worst trade in the NFL, but for the STEELERS, as time goes on and he keeps winning games. it will be looked back on is all I'm saying

--- Added 11/22/2010 at 05:25 PM ---


Its simple. The team couldn't afford to take any extra bad publicity and had to do something. Who is more important to the team, Roethlisberger or Holmes? Cut ties with Holmes to try to give the appearance that you won't put up with it and hold onto the player that will make a greater impact on the team. I would not mind having Holmes on the roster, but it is doubtful that he would have stayed after this season. Look at the bright side, Sanders and Brown are showing promise and Wallace is developing into a good receiver. Holmes would have been the cherry on top, but you can't have it all.

Ya that's it man, you're right. Ben is more important then Holmes and they had to make a decision. I think Sanders and Brown are showing huge strides and Wallace is averaging 23 yards per catch right now, I love it. I'm just saying a 5th round pick for Holmes is ****ing bogus and you're going to see what I'm talking about.

K Train
11-22-2010, 07:31 PM
ward getting hurt was the best thing to happen to wallace against the patriots....it clicked for him and now hes locked in beast mode...hes starting to do the things ive missed of holmes

harpo
11-22-2010, 07:46 PM
Holmes is a FA at season's end and everyone knows he's going to want a boatload of money. The Steelers were not going to pay Holmes the money he wanted, and since they were only slated to get 12 games out of him anyways (i.e. 4 gm suspension), they cut their ties with him in hopes that Mike Wallace could fill the void.

So I don't think his smoking weed was the straw that broke the camel's back. I think it was a business decision, which they're going to regret for at lest one game when they play the Jets.

tburg68
11-22-2010, 07:50 PM
ben was accused of sexual assault multiple times and harrison beat on his gf a few times.

holmes.....smoked weed? lol

pittsburgh does tolerate bad behavior....i love how everything thinks that being a steeler=being a choir boy

Some Steeler fans like to look at things through Black and Gold glasses. I don't care much what players do off the field, because the reality of this day and age is that if I did, I wouldn't have sports to watch if players were kicked out because of behavior.

This trade was a big loss by the Steelers no matter how you slice it. However, it is not close to the worst trade in NFL history.

K Train
11-22-2010, 07:54 PM
Holmes is a FA at season's end and everyone knows he's going to want a boatload of money. The Steelers were not going to pay Holmes the money he wanted, and since they were only slated to get 12 games out of him anyways (i.e. 4 gm suspension), they cut their ties with him in hopes that Mike Wallace could fill the void.

So I don't think his smoking weed was the straw that broke the camel's back. I think it was a business decision, which they're going to regret for at lest one game when they play the Jets.

please tell me how the bolded is anything but complete bs?

the market will not be HUGE for holmes, not like hes gonna break records....but he will have a decent market and will definitely not command top dollar for the position. Remember back when ward commanded to be paid like a top 5 WR? well the steelers caved and he failed to produce like a top 5 WR since then....solid, sure, but by no means elite.

Holmes will get paid less than guys like jennings and white and have some suspension clauses in it, a boatload of money would be in the category of fitz, andre, calvin, moss. his contract might be a little more than the one he got going 25th overall...but hes not gonna be breaking anyones bank

tburg68
11-22-2010, 08:40 PM
Holmes is a very good receiver. The Steelers receiving core would definitely be better with him. To argue otherwise is ignorance. Bottom line in responding to this thread is that is was a bad trade by the Steelers whether they resigned Holmes or not. No one should be shocked by a pro athlete trying to get paid as much as possible, it also has nothing to do with the value of this trade.

harpo
11-23-2010, 10:14 AM
please tell me how the bolded is anything but complete bs?

the market will not be HUGE for holmes, not like hes gonna break records....but he will have a decent market and will definitely not command top dollar for the position. Remember back when ward commanded to be paid like a top 5 WR? well the steelers caved and he failed to produce like a top 5 WR since then....solid, sure, but by no means elite.

Holmes will get paid less than guys like jennings and white and have some suspension clauses in it, a boatload of money would be in the category of fitz, andre, calvin, moss. his contract might be a little more than the one he got going 25th overall...but hes not gonna be breaking anyones bank


Look, we all know that the Steelers don't pay out huge paydays compared to other teams. So the "boatload" reference was in reference to how "stingy" the Steelers have been over the years.

Holmes will get paid but I never said he was going to break anyone's bank. The bottomline is he will get more money in NY than he was going to get in Pittsburgh. So, when you look at it in those terms, it's not complete bs....with all due respect.

igor0190
11-23-2010, 10:22 AM
All things equal, if the Steelers matched the offers of other teams in free agency I still think Santonio would have left. It was still a mistake for only a 5th round pick. They should have been able to get more.

The Steelers tried to get rid of Ben, the Rams didn't go for it.
Harrison hasn't had any off the field issues in a long time that I can remember.

TampaSteelGirl
11-23-2010, 10:24 AM
WALLACE WILL BE BETTER THAN SANTONIO EVER WAS/WILL BE!! :markit:

harpo
11-23-2010, 10:30 AM
WALLACE WILL BE BETTER THAN SANTONIO EVER WAS/WILL BE!! :markit:

That's a pretty strong statement.....lol.

I'm marking it down. :yellowthumb:

jnes1216
11-23-2010, 10:45 AM
This trade was clearly a gut reaction by the FO to try and clean up their public image. I think they could have gotten more out of it if they had better timing. We had a lot of picks this past draft and I think we could have bundled a late rounder with Holmes for a higher pick or a player like Lee Evans who we face next week. Bills GM had ties with Pittsburgh. All of this being hindsight anyway. If we would have kept Holmes I don't think he would have resigned and we could have used franchise tag etc. Because after this year with all the fines etc, I think the FO may have a different take on public image.

TampaSteelGirl
11-23-2010, 10:46 AM
That's a pretty strong statement.....lol.

I'm marking it down. :yellowthumb:

Have you been watching the kid??? Just sayin...

Blazedby92
11-23-2010, 10:53 AM
Lee Evans, Who???
No thank you, I would of taken a chance on 5th rounder before i'd do that, Holmes was the scapegoat, it could have been Ben and you seen the effects of not having Ben around.

harpo
11-23-2010, 12:04 PM
Have you been watching the kid??? Just sayin...

Yeah, i've been watching him. I'm not saying he won't but i'm just being cautious....that's all. :yellowthumb:

Steelerlyn
11-23-2010, 12:16 PM
gotta agree

igor0190
11-23-2010, 12:34 PM
WALLACE WILL BE BETTER THAN SANTONIO EVER WAS/WILL BE!! :markit:

:plus1:
He may very well be ALREADY. Mike Wallace is twice the player Santonio was at this point in his career.

TampaSteelGirl
11-23-2010, 01:18 PM
:plus1:
He may very well be ALREADY. Mike Wallace is twice the player Santonio was at this point in his career.

Thank you!!! :yellowthumb:

K Train
11-23-2010, 01:55 PM
hes not already....holmes is very well rounder, something wallace is not (last 2 weeks wallace has however taken it upon himself to dominate the world)....holmes is a better route runner and a much better blocker and so much better after the catch, he refuses to go down. whether wallace ends up being better dont 1) forget what holmes did for this team, and 2) dont undermine holmes talent because he is very talented.....i dont care what you say, holmes and wallace on the outside and ward and sanders working the slot would be amazing

coldrolled
11-23-2010, 02:10 PM
it seems holmes is a big name now that he is in his big market were he would have forced himself into after this year if he was still a steeler. good for him..

now lets just call more crossing routes, 5-10 yard slant routes and see how sanders, wallace and brown do with those plays. all of holmes's plays are the same style play in NY, we just dont call enough of them, when we do call the plays like wallaces 5yard/52 yard play they work often. just like holmes did here and is doing with the jets now.

call those plays... not just one each game.

Clevelandsux
11-23-2010, 03:39 PM
ben was accused of sexual assault multiple times and harrison beat on his gf a few times.

holmes.....smoked weed? lol

pittsburgh does tolerate bad behavior....i love how everything thinks that being a steeler=being a choir boy

Because you probably smoke weed. Holmes had been busted twice. It's against NFL policy. You know it and he knows it.

K Train
11-23-2010, 04:12 PM
Because you probably smoke weed. Holmes had been busted twice. It's against NFL policy. You know it and he knows it.

funny thing is, i dont. its against americas policy...but so is sexual assault, but bens multiple cases were tolerable i guess right?

harpo
11-23-2010, 07:47 PM
i dont care what you say, holmes and wallace on the outside and ward and randle-el working the slot would be amazing

Fixed it for ya. :yellowthumb::lol:

steelersbabex25
11-23-2010, 11:53 PM
Because you probably smoke weed. Holmes had been busted twice. It's against NFL policy. You know it and he knows it.

The thing is, Holmes wasn't some bum player on the practice squad fighting for a chance to get into a game. He was a vital component on offense, and they couldn't wait 4 games for him? That was the first time he was suspended, correct? Ben has gotten into trouble more times than I can count on one hand and he's still there.

My point is, yeah sure, they were trying to make him a scapegoat. Alright. He was out for 4 games of the season. Sure. But was getting rid of him because he was missing those first 4 games worth losing him for the rest of his career?


:plus1:
He may very well be ALREADY. Mike Wallace is twice the player Santonio was at this point in his career.

The only thing that Wallace has on Holmes is his speed and height, and that's not anything you have to work for. Don't get me wrong, I think Wallace is awesome. He's definitely been extremely reliable and he's been getting the offense going. However, as Ktrain said, Holmes was more well-rounded I would say. He was the go to guy at the end of the game, the guy Ben could always count on to pick up that big first down or touchdown or whatever. Can we count on Wallace to get the big play at the end of the game for the win? Don't know. Guess we'll have to see.