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View Full Version : Next Steelers to make the H.O.F ?



XLJohn
08-11-2010, 10:27 AM
With the Hall of Fame behind us and congrates to Dick Lebeau who will be the next Steelers enshrined thats not playing.......
Jerome Bettis
Myron Cope
Dermanti Dawson
LC Greenwood
Just a few I was thinking of I still do not understand LC not being in but whats your thoughts??

Layin the wood
08-11-2010, 10:48 AM
I think that all four of those guys will be in the HOF at some point. The next HOF player from the Steelers to be inducted will probably be Dawson with Bettis right behind him and like you i dont understand why Greenwood is not in yet but it will happen!!

HUNT4SEVEN
08-11-2010, 12:48 PM
Everyone on that list has a chance except for Bettis, because he's up against Faulk and another running back and the so called experts says there's no way 3 backs get in, I hope JB gets in though we will just have to wait and see...

K Train
08-11-2010, 01:27 PM
bettis has the best chance of any steeler this decade lol, hes not a first ballot guy like emmit or faulk but he can certainly find a spot there, he was a rare player

steelcitysfinestXL
08-11-2010, 01:35 PM
If the other back you're considering is Tiki Barber... then im not sure JB doesnt go in before him. Bettis has 3,000 more yards (1,000 more car.) and WAY more touchdowns (even incluing both of their REC. tds JB is still 27 tds ahead) Tiki has FAR better rec. numbers than JB but JB has the RING... it will be close to see who gets in with Marshall next year! Im guessing Dawson will be next but its gonna take some help from his friends. Bettis is still fresh in peoples minds and still affiliated with the NFL via broadcasting.

--- Added 8/11/2010 at 12:35 PM ---


bettis has the best chance of any steeler this decade lol, hes not a first ballot guy like emmit or faulk but he can certainly find a spot there, he was a rare player

:plus1: Yeah Tiki was a LESS talented version of Marshall Faulk who is a lock first ballot guy. Bettis was a RARE breed. Though he was up an down a couple times in his career, he still accumulated GREAT numbers as a 270lb every down tailback!

darnik44
08-12-2010, 06:46 AM
These former/current Steelers should all be in the HOF in time. I think this should be close to the order they go in.

1. Dermonti Dawson (should already be in)

2. Jerome Bettis (2nd ballot)

3. Gary Anderson (NFL All-Time leading scorer)

4. Myron Cope

5. L.C. Greenwood (eventually the veterans commitee will get him in

6. Kevin Greene (within the next 4-5 years)

7. Alan Faneca (should be a 1st ballot HOFer)

8. Hines Ward (might take 10 years after retirment, but he'll get in (2023?)

9. Bill Cowher (could be awhile if he get's back into coaching)

10. Troy Polamalu (provided he can get healthy and stay healthy)

11. Ben Roethlisberger (barring no more off the field issues, and continued success, 1 more SB win makes him a lock)

Stlrs4Life
08-12-2010, 10:26 AM
Dermonti Dawson

K Train
08-12-2010, 10:42 AM
1. Dermonti Dawson (should already be in)

eventually

2. Jerome Bettis (2nd ballot)

agreed

3. Gary Anderson (NFL All-Time leading scorer)

lol no way, theres just no love for kickers in the hall

4. Myron Cope

a broadcaster? wtf business does a broadcaster for the steelers have in the pro football hall of fame? no way this ever happens

5. L.C. Greenwood (eventually the veterans commitee will get him in

eh...probably

6. Kevin Greene (within the next 4-5 years)

definitely possible

7. Alan Faneca (should be a 1st ballot HOFer)

probably will be

8. Hines Ward (might take 10 years after retirment, but he'll get in (2023?)

will NEVER sniff the hall, the generation of receivers hes played among just dwaff his abilities and stats....throwing a few nice blocks doesnt make him hall worthy by any stretch of the imagination

9. Bill Cowher (could be awhile if he get's back into coaching)

why may i ask? what has he accomplished that was that special?

10. Troy Polamalu (provided he can get healthy and stay healthy)

pretty overrated by the world, i dont see how he can play long enough to be hall worthy the way he plays

11. Ben Roethlisberger (barring no more off the field issues, and continued success, 1 more SB win makes him a lock)

agreed

LatrobePA
08-12-2010, 10:49 AM
Isaac Redman..

andyg1984
08-12-2010, 01:07 PM
yeah, i was wondering why myron cope was on the list ...

k-train, did you have to put it that way about hines? the truth hurts man .. lol .. .. i agree it will be controversial at the least if he gets in.. ****, my man chris carter is not even in yet

igor0190
08-12-2010, 01:09 PM
Isaac Redman..

HAHA :lol:

Followed closely by Frank the Tank

K Train
08-12-2010, 01:25 PM
chris carter, andre reed, tim brown waiting for their inductions and hines will retire in a generation that is going to have TO, Randy Moss (both locks), as well as guys like andre johnson, larry fitz, and other guys that are so much better than ward its brutal to even compare.

wards been great for us, but hes nothing that special....a good underneath guy, super tough, throws a mean blcok, is vicious in the slot but hes just not nor has he ever been a top 10 WR in the league, MAYBE barely cracking the top 10 a few times in his career but the hall of fame is for the best of the best, not just the consistently good.

steelcitysfinestXL
08-12-2010, 02:14 PM
chris carter, andre reed, tim brown waiting for their inductions and hines will retire in a generation that is going to have TO, Randy Moss (both locks), as well as guys like andre johnson, larry fitz, and other guys that are so much better than ward its brutal to even compare.

wards been great for us, but hes nothing that special....a good underneath guy, super tough, throws a mean blcok, is vicious in the slot but hes just not nor has he ever been a top 10 WR in the league, MAYBE barely cracking the top 10 a few times in his career but the hall of fame is for the best of the best, not just the consistently good.

Hines only draws HOF recognition to people who are familiar with Steelers History. He holds about every Steelers record a WR can achieve and he surpassed 2 HOFs to do it. I think thats why get draws the HOF "worthiness" he does among steeler fans.

Truth is Hines is kinda screwed... He's gonna retire with in 2-3 season of Marvin Harrison, T.O and Randy Moss... three guys he has no shot of catching stats wise. Its pointless to even bring up Johnson and Fitz because they have 6+ years left each (fitz maybe 8 or more) They are both on pace to pass Moss and TO's numbers by the time they hit 34 (TO's age) Fitz is only 26 and he is halfway to beating all of Moss's numbers (who is 33)

But to say Hines isnt speacial is a slap in the face to greats like Tim Brown, Cris Carter, Rod Smith and Andre Carter... because STATISTICALLY Hines (if he plays 3-4 more seasons) will rank right up there with them. He already has Rod Smith beat. He WILL pass Andre Reed in EVERY category except yards this season. He MAY pass Carter and Brown the season after. So if hines has 2 more years like last year (doubtful but possible) he will pass Tim Brown and Cris Carter in receptions.

IF Hines plays 16-17 season (like Carter and Brown) He will have better numbers than Cris Carter and Tim Brown... which makes him a great player. Similar or BETTER numbers PLUS a Super Bowl MVP and 2 rings puts him above those two... NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY. And all that, prob still wont get him into the Hall!!!!:banging:

K Train
08-12-2010, 02:21 PM
Hines only draws HOF recognition to people who are familiar with Steelers History. He holds about every Steelers record a WR can achieve and he surpassed 2 HOFs to do it. I think thats why get draws the HOF "worthiness" he does among steeler fans.

Truth is Hines is kinda screwed... He's gonna retire with in 2-3 season of Marvin Harrison, T.O and Randy Moss... three guys he has no shot of catching stats wise. Its pointless to even bring up Johnson and Fitz because they have 6+ years left each (fitz maybe 8 or more) They are both on pace to pass Moss and TO's numbers by the time they hit 34 (TO's age) Fitz is only 26 and he is halfway to beating all of Moss's numbers (who is 33)

But to say Hines isnt speacial is a slap in the face to greats like Tim Brown, Cris Carter, Rod Smith and Andre Carter... because STATISTICALLY Hines (if he plays 3-4 more seasons) will rank right up there with them. He already has Rod Smith beat. He WILL pass Andre Reed in EVERY category except yards this season. He MAY pass Carter and Brown the season after. So if hines has 2 more years like last year (doubtful but possible) he will pass Tim Brown and Cris Carter in receptions.

IF Hines plays 16-17 season (like Carter and Brown) He will have better numbers than Cris Carter and Tim Brown... which makes him a great player. Similar or BETTER numbers PLUS a Super Bowl MVP and 2 rings puts him above those two... NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY. And all that, prob still wont get him into the Hall!!!!:banging:

thats longevity though...issac bruce had a tremendous career, hes not gonna make the hall even though he had a career that most only dream of. Hines beat all the steeler records sure, but the league changes so much....those guys that had the steeler records before hines were among the best of their era, something ward is not...he would surely make a steelers hall of fame, but the pro football hall of fame theres no chance in hell.

carter, brown, reed were stars in their day, if hines passes their stats thats fine but they were great back then and were the best at their position, hines isnt now nor was he ever thats all im saying.

my point is, hes not even going to be in the discussion....ever, the hall doesnt like WRs and theres already a healthy backup of guys that deserve to be in with a bunch of guys that are locks coming up in the next decade of inductions

steelcitysfinestXL
08-12-2010, 02:53 PM
thats longevity though...issac bruce had a tremendous career, hes not gonna make the hall even though he had a career that most only dream of. Hines beat all the steeler records sure, but the league changes so much....those guys that had the steeler records before hines were among the best of their era, something ward is not...he would surely make a steelers hall of fame, but the pro football hall of fame theres no chance in hell.

carter, brown, reed were stars in their day, if hines passes their stats thats fine but they were great back then and were the best at their position, hines isnt now nor was he ever thats all im saying.

my point is, hes not even going to be in the discussion....ever, the hall doesnt like WRs and theres already a healthy backup of guys that deserve to be in with a bunch of guys that are locks coming up in the next decade of inductions

Ok lets clear this up: HINES WONT MAKE THE HOF... EVER!!!

Not disagreeing with you on the FACT that Hines isnt gonna sniff the Hall. My point was, he does deserve to be mentioned in the class with guys like Carter, Brown, Reed, Smith and the likes. That list of guys that "Just Missed" Jerry Rice and Michael Irvin had better careers in that era, but the other guys were still GREAT players!

Heres my comparison:

Hines (33):
6th ACTIVE Career recs
8th ACTIVE in yards
5th ACTIVE in tds

Randy Moss (32) is the only guy younger AND with better career numbers than Hines...
SO, it kinda looks like HINES WARD has been a top ten quality guy his whole career. Just for a reference Randy Moss, TO and Tony Gonzales are the only active guys whos numbers are all better than Hines Ward... those 3 are LOCKS to get to the hall and they are all with in 3 years of age! So they are the BEST of their era... but Hines was still GREAT (not hall worthy!) In the end, Hines shoulod still rest easy... none of them have a ring, let alone two and a MVP!

SteelDad
08-12-2010, 04:18 PM
Couple of comments here....

#1. I see the arguments against HW getting in, but here's WHY he gets in. He is a complete wide receiver. He catches, he blocks, he runs the ball. He can go deep or he can go across the middle. He is as much a QB on the field as the QB himself. He inspires with his play and his words. And he is respected across the NFL. First ballot? No, but I believe he gets in.

#2. The issue of Myron Cope. The NFL, like MLB, has a broadcasters/writers wing in the HoF. While MC may not have reached across the country like national writers or guys who do regional coverage in one sport and national in others, he has to be one of the most unique individuals to ever call a game. Let's not forget, the Terrible Towel is THE most recognized team related item in sports and that contribution can't be overlooked either.

andyg1984
08-12-2010, 04:35 PM
as much as i love him, there has never been a defensive coordinator in the league who was ever worried about hines ward like TO or Moss .. some might go as far to say that no DC was ever worried about Ward but I don't really wanna start that ..

again, i love hines, but where did you see him run deep routes?? in hs??

as for myron cope, he means something to us but he is far from a household name and where would it stop if cope got in ? he is lightyears away from even being in the conversation for HOF ..

darnik44
08-12-2010, 09:00 PM
Players do not get into the Hall of Fame strictly based on stats. There are many factors that play in to it. Ward wouldn't get in based on stats alone. You have to look at things like him being considered the best blocking WR of all-time, but more so the way he changed the game. Because of Hines Ward, receivers are now expected to block. Good blocking receivers used to be a luxury, now, it's expected. He has a rule named after him, he has two SB rings, including a SB MVP, and even the fact he's half Korean will play a factor. There are no HOFer's of Korean desent. Hines Ward was also a pioneer of sorts coming out of college. He was one of the early QB/ATH type of prospects to be drafted and make an impact. He's been squeaky clean off the field, something guys like Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, and Chris Carter don't have going for them. I guarantee Ward get's in...

K Train
08-12-2010, 10:53 PM
Couple of comments here....

#1. I see the arguments against HW getting in, but here's WHY he gets in. He is a complete wide receiver. He catches, he blocks, he runs the ball. He can go deep or he can go across the middle. He is as much a QB on the field as the QB himself. He inspires with his play and his words. And he is respected across the NFL. First ballot? No, but I believe he gets in.

#2. The issue of Myron Cope. The NFL, like MLB, has a broadcasters/writers wing in the HoF. While MC may not have reached across the country like national writers or guys who do regional coverage in one sport and national in others, he has to be one of the most unique individuals to ever call a game. Let's not forget, the Terrible Towel is THE most recognized team related item in sports and that contribution can't be overlooked either.
so he found a yellow towel to wave around, i dont think that changed the world that much

ward wont get in...being a "complete" player in that he can block isnt how you get in the hall, theres been tons of solid players who were pretty well rounded. thats the ONLY argument hines has for the hall, and its from only steeler fans. theres just no room for a player like ward among the best of the best, were talking all time greats, something only big time homers would look at ward as, hes a very average WR, hes just been around a long time and made the most of his opprtunites

K Train
08-12-2010, 10:54 PM
Players do not get into the Hall of Fame strictly based on stats. There are many factors that play in to it. Ward wouldn't get in based on stats alone. You have to look at things like him being considered the best blocking WR of all-time, but more so the way he changed the game. Because of Hines Ward, receivers are now expected to block. Good blocking receivers used to be a luxury, now, it's expected. He has a rule named after him, he has two SB rings, including a SB MVP, and even the fact he's half Korean will play a factor. There are no HOFer's of Korean desent. Hines Ward was also a pioneer of sorts coming out of college. He was one of the early QB/ATH type of prospects to be drafted and make an impact. He's been squeaky clean off the field, something guys like Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, and Chris Carter don't have going for them. I guarantee Ward get's in...

squeaky clean? hes known as one of the dirtiest current players.

hines didnt revolutionize the position, he was just a good blocker, those have been around for a long time. ward is a mini TE, thats not that special

darnik44
08-13-2010, 05:53 AM
squeaky clean? hes known as one of the dirtiest current players.

hines didnt revolutionize the position, he was just a good blocker, those have been around for a long time. ward is a mini TE, thats not that special

Sqeaky clean off the field. Yes he did revolutionize the position. Because of Hines, receivers are expected to be good blockers.

I guess you don't grasp the criteria to be a HOF player. Ward will be in 9-12 years after he retires.

steelcitysfinestXL
08-13-2010, 07:25 AM
Sqeaky clean off the field. Yes he did revolutionize the position. Because of Hines, receivers are expected to be good blockers.

I guess you don't grasp the criteria to be a HOF player. Ward will be in 9-12 years after he retires.

I give Hines credit for being a great WR, because he is. I just dont think he will get into the Hall. If he does, good on him, but im not gonna say i think he deserves it. I know numbers arent EVERYTHING, and he has some good stats, but he's nowhere close to (statswise/impact on the game)TO, Marvin, Moss and they are all the same age. Guys with similar longevity and stats as Hines have been left out of the hall (Tim Brown, Cris Carter, Andre Reed) because they werent THE BEST when they played. The Michael Irvings and Jerry Rices were!

Im just saying, it doesnt set up well for Hines UNLESS he is retires before Moss and TO, and is somehow first ballot guy... which we ALL agree aint happening. If he retires the same year as TO and or Moss (assuming Marvin DOESNT come back) He's toast because he cant stack up to them and Fitz, A.Johnson, Reggie Wayne, and the likes are NOW setting the standards for top flight WRs. So in 9-12 years Hines is ROYALY screwed. I love the guy and i give him credit for being GREAT, i just dont see the Hall in his future!

By the way: TO is "squeaky clean" off the field. Ya may not like him (or you may) but he's never been in legal trouble and i hate the fact that he gets lumped in with the likes of Moss, Vick and Henry. TO is a LOUD MOUTH, maybe the loudest, but theres nothing illegal about that!

K Train
08-13-2010, 08:18 AM
lol he did not revolutionize the position....WRs have been blocking for decades, he is just a really good one and thats what he gets noticed for because it covers up the fact that hes not a really good outside WR, one that scares a defense and is a threat to score all the time.

TO is a great blocker, but no one looks at him as a blocker because hes so dangerous to score. Scoring TDs>throwing a nice block

blocking WRs arent hall worthy, ones that pull down over 80 catches a year and score double digit TDs and get 1400 yards consistently are. the only position that gets in the hall based off excellent blocking are linemen, not even TEs can be hall worthy from being a tremendous blocker and thats half their job

steelcitysfinestXL
08-13-2010, 08:38 AM
lol he did not revolutionize the position....WRs have been blocking for decades, he is just a really good one and thats what he gets noticed for because it covers up the fact that hes not a really good outside WR, one that scares a defense and is a threat to score all the time.

TO is a great blocker, but no one looks at him as a blocker because hes so dangerous to score. Scoring TDs>throwing a nice block

blocking WRs arent hall worthy, ones that pull down over 80 catches a year and score double digit TDs and get 1400 yards consistently are. the only position that gets in the hall based off excellent blocking are linemen, not even TEs can be hall worthy from being a tremendous blocker and thats half their job

:plus1: like someone else said, Hines HAS NEVER been the WR opposing defenses keyed on. NEVER, that probley contributed to his success, which is taking nothing away from him... just a fact. Think about Plex, Holmes and probley now Wallace with is speed, those are our WR's teams try to shut down... Hines is that "jack of all trades" guy that we have had the luxury of having for 13+ years!

TO is a MONSTER blocking and his play as a WR just completely over shadows that. Just to try and throw a lil more credit Hines way... Hines never (until the last two seasons) played in an offense condusive of him putting up TO/Moss like numbers. We were a running team for alot of his years and he STILL may match the output of a guy like Carter or Brown. I've always said: Imagine if Hines was a Colt during his whole career playing that slot that Brandon Stokley, and now TE Dallas Clark thrives in??? He would have put up Wes Welker like numbers for his whole career!!!

K Train
08-13-2010, 08:43 AM
yeah but the colts can give austin collie and pierre garcon good numbers, they could end up with ward numbers and wouldnt be in the hall discussion either lol. brandon stokley had like 12 TDs one year as a colt, not saying any of these guys are bad but they arent as good as their QB.

hines is good, steady, and pretty clutch....but imo its his clutchness like on 3rd and 8 that has made him valuable to us, but i really dont think if we let him go 6 years ago when he got that huge deal (that he didnt really deserve) we wouldnt have missed a beat because his on field production is pretty replaceable.

never been the biggest ward fan myself, but i see him for what he is, just a steady all around good football player

steelcitysfinestXL
08-13-2010, 08:57 AM
Not to mention, how many 2000 decade Steelers can actually go to the HOF? Troy, JB, Dermonti Dawson (he was 90's i know but hes still not in) are all worthy. Ben and Hampton could both make a case by the time they retire (Ben would have to have a few more seasons like last year or better). So thats 5 guys i have ahead of Hines from this team and decade.

K Train
08-13-2010, 09:03 AM
justin hartwig and issac redman too

darnik44
08-13-2010, 08:34 PM
Some of you refuse to look at reality. Here's some reality...Chris Carter for my money is the 2nd best receiver of all-time. His stats speak volumns and the way he played the game did as well. But in the eyes of the Hall of Fame voters he only has numbers. He was a train wreak off the field early on in his career, and never won anything. This is why he isn't already in the Hall of Fame. Eventually he will be in, but not the 1st or even 2nd ballot because he simply lacks anything (other than stats) to put him there.

Hines Ward on the other hand has a multitude of non-statistical reasons to be in the Hall of Fame. For anyone who thinks he didn't change the WR position, you are dead wrong and need to do some research and get your facts straight.

Some of you even mention Marvin Harrison as a Hall of Famer...not a chance in hell. Not with his recent troubles. He had us all fooled for years into thinking he was a good guy. Check the record, he's a thug.

As for T.O., he's a clown. No way the Hall of Fame voters make it easy on him. The Hall of Fame is a place for those who made important contributions to professional football, not those who highlighted all the negatives of pro athletes like T.O. has.

For those of you who were still playing with toys when Hines was in his prime, here's some facts...

2001-2004

381 receptions (95.25/year) for 4,499 yards (1,124.75/year) and 30 TD's (7.5/year)


2005-2006 (Missed 3 games)

143 receptions (71.5/year) for 1,950 yards (975/year) and 17 TD's (8.5/ year)


2007-2009 (Missed 3 games)

247 receptions (82.3/year) for 2,942 yards (980/year) and 20 TD's (6.67/year)



-4 Pro Bowls (consecutive)

-All NFL team 2002 and 2003

-6 1,000 yard seasons

-Super Bowl XL MVP

-2 Super Bowl rings...and counting

-The first player of Korean descent to play in the Super Bowl

-A pioneer as a QB/ATH Draft prospect

-Steelers All-Time leading receiver in every category

-Has a rule named after him

DanRooney
08-13-2010, 09:28 PM
Hines will make the HOF. He'll have to wait a while, but he gets in.

andyg1984
08-13-2010, 11:08 PM
TO gets in before Hines easily or in substitute of imo ... TO was a beast and could dominate just like Fitz, AJ, Calvin, Marshall, Moss.. they are constant match-up problems ... i would kill for some of their ego issues in trade of ward's consistency and blocking in a passing league ..

nuclearchihuahuas
08-13-2010, 11:30 PM
dawson is next then bettis:imho:

steelcitysfinestXL
08-14-2010, 08:23 AM
Some of you refuse to look at reality. Here's some reality...Chris Carter for my money is the 2nd best receiver of all-time. His stats speak volumns and the way he played the game did as well. But in the eyes of the Hall of Fame voters he only has numbers. He was a train wreak off the field early on in his career, and never won anything. This is why he isn't already in the Hall of Fame. Eventually he will be in, but not the 1st or even 2nd ballot because he simply lacks anything (other than stats) to put him there.

Hines Ward on the other hand has a multitude of non-statistical reasons to be in the Hall of Fame. For anyone who thinks he didn't change the WR position, you are dead wrong and need to do some research and get your facts straight.

Some of you even mention Marvin Harrison as a Hall of Famer...not a chance in hell. Not with his recent troubles. He had us all fooled for years into thinking he was a good guy. Check the record, he's a thug.

As for T.O., he's a clown. No way the Hall of Fame voters make it easy on him. The Hall of Fame is a place for those who made important contributions to professional football, not those who highlighted all the negatives of pro athletes like T.O. has.

For those of you who were still playing with toys when Hines was in his prime, here's some facts...


Yeah all thats well and good... and im as big of a Hines Ward fan as there is, but I just dont see it. All the **** you mentioned (about hines) is very valid... im not saying he wont get consderation. 7-8 years from now, I see Hines sitting in NFLN/CBS broadcasting booth being that guy every spring getting asked "Hines, is this your year?"

I think his rings, SB MVP, and numbers are all worthy of Hall consideration. But, my point has been since my first post, his timing is not good.

Terell Owens: While he is hated by MANY is one of the best WR's in our (well my) generation. His numbers are AMAZING, he is the SECOND best blocking WR in the game, since thats seems to be so important to point out. And, despite popular belief, he has NEVER been in legal trouble... not that i think that much matters. Michael Irvin, i believe was first ballot! T.O. is more HOF worthy that Hines.

Randy Moss: His TD numbers almost are RICE-LIKE. He did it with multiple teams. He did it year in and year out (- a few seasons in football hell, OAK) His legal troubles were minimal, even though i dont think that makes MUCH of a difference

Marvin Harrision: 12 playing seasons and he has all the numbers Moss and TO do in 13+. SECOND in recs. to only Jerry Rice. SB winner. HES A THUG? He had one incident LATE in his career. May i remind you, Michael Irvin and Lawrence Taylor were inducted too! I know it helps to be a stand up guy, but if you great your great!

IF, Jerry rice is the measuring stick to what a HOF WR is, then these guys, Statistically, are the 3 next best WRs to date. I know stats arent everything, but stats like these guys racked up are legendary.

If Hines left with Tim Brown, Cris Carter and Andre Reed... with all of his accomplishments, he would have made the Hall. Now WR's put up un-godly numbers every year and Hines cant match that. Do I think Hines is HOF worthy, maybe. If he got it i wouldnt say its a sham, he has the credentials on and off the field. In the right year of eligability, i would vote for him for sure. I just think he is in an era where there were some of the best ever, and he's gonna have a rough time!

And your comment about... "For those of you who were still playing with toys when Hines was in his prime, here's some facts..." Looks EVEN more rediculous when the 3 guys i mentioned, were dominating the NFL in Hines Prime... Hines was never a number #1 WR as a steeler ( one year- the SBXL year)... I hope he gets in... but i wouldnt bet on it!

airbrake 1
08-14-2010, 09:53 AM
dawson should have been a first ballot enshrinee, as far as i'm concerned the best center to ever play the game.
jerome bettis will get in but he'll probably have to wait 5-10 years, i think deservedly so. But if he doesn't get in in this time period it's a travesty.
Heinz ward will get in but will again have to wait at least 10-15 years. What he's done already is enough.
The biggest issue i have with the hall is Donnie Shell not being in, his numbers measure comparably to mel blounts at a position not thrown at as often. People say he was only a special team and back up on the first two super bowls so what, a player can't choose when their born. He has the goods to get in period, but steeler bias will probably keep shell and greenwood out. and if the steelers of this era keep up the level they're playing at we may have a second group of players kept out because too many are going to get in...bull...:tt02:

Dobre Shunka
08-14-2010, 11:18 AM
Mighty Dawson should be in. I hope he makes it on the next ballot.
Bettis, goes in.

LC, may never get in. That is the real shame.

All this talk of Hines, eventually he goes in the Hall as he should. Stats wise, he's very competitive and if he has a couple more good seasons, it's building. Longevity, he has it.
He certainly has impacted the game as it is played today, in his way, which is what the Hall is looking at too. He represents the sport well.

Whilst I agree he's certainly not a lock IN, I totally disagree that he's a lock not to make it.

Mryon, well, he's in my HOF, so what.

SteelDad
08-14-2010, 02:54 PM
so he found a yellow towel to wave around, i dont think that changed the world that much

ward wont get in...being a "complete" player in that he can block isnt how you get in the hall, theres been tons of solid players who were pretty well rounded. thats the ONLY argument hines has for the hall, and its from only steeler fans. theres just no room for a player like ward among the best of the best, were talking all time greats, something only big time homers would look at ward as, hes a very average WR, hes just been around a long time and made the most of his opprtunites

In regards to MC, I'm only providing the argument as to why he could get in the writers/broadcasters wing and I'm certainly not saying he should get in based on waving the towel. Although, I find it interesting to see so many pictures of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan and there always seems to be a terrible towel in many of them versus other teams' fans who might have a jersey or flag so I would argue slightly that the TT has made an impression:tt02:

In regards to HW, you'll get no argument from me that he is not in the elite class of receivers like Moss or Owens or Fitzgerald and Johnson, but someone made the comment that d-coordinators didn't create gameplans to stop HW. Wrong. While no one gameplan centers around stopping HW, I guarantee every DC in the league talks with their defenders about how you stop HW in the flats, the curl zones, and how to discern where is going on choice routes. Nobody runs those routes better than he does. I'd be curious to see what percentage of his catches are for first downs... You know every defender on every team talks about 'head on a swivel' when playing Ward. Is that HoF worthy? No, but don't tell me teams don't gameplan around him. In the end, HW will be the all-time leader for us in catches, yards, TDs and a few others. He will be a victim of the other great receivers going in at the same time. I'm sure I have on black and gold glasses, but outside of those few elite guys, there has been no one better over the same period of time.

steelcitysfinestXL
08-14-2010, 03:19 PM
In regards to MC, I'm only providing the argument as to why he could get in the writers/broadcasters wing and I'm certainly not saying he should get in based on waving the towel. Although, I find it interesting to see so many pictures of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan and there always seems to be a terrible towel in many of them versus other teams' fans who might have a jersey or flag so I would argue slightly that the TT has made an impression:tt02:

In regards to HW, you'll get no argument from me that he is not in the elite class of receivers like Moss or Owens or Fitzgerald and Johnson, but someone made the comment that d-coordinators didn't create gameplans to stop HW. Wrong. While no one gameplan centers around stopping HW, I guarantee every DC in the league talks with their defenders about how you stop HW in the flats, the curl zones, and how to discern where is going on choice routes. Nobody runs those routes better than he does. I'd be curious to see what percentage of his catches are for first downs... You know every defender on every team talks about 'head on a swivel' when playing Ward. Is that HoF worthy? No, but don't tell me teams don't gameplan around him. In the end, HW will be the all-time leader for us in catches, yards, TDs and a few others. He will be a victim of the other great receivers going in at the same time. I'm sure I have on black and gold glasses, but outside of those few elite guys, there has been no one better over the same period of time.

great post!

Im the one that said D co-ordinators dont gameplan to stop Hines Ward. While you made some good points about things Hines has excelled at, i still doubt many, if any DCs have Hines as a top priority.

From Plex to Holmes, Hines has never been the guy you had to stop. And i think Wallace is gonna be the next in line. Hines NEVER had that "breakaway" speed or verticle threat to his game. He is a guy who you put your #2 corner on and PRAY he makes the tackle whe ward makes a catch. But the years where we did well as a passing offense, we had great "Tandums". Plex and Hines were a no.1 WR tandum 2 consecutive seasons. I dont think many teams tried matching their top CB against Hines cause Burress would of had a field day... same with Holmes.

Dobre Shunka
08-14-2010, 06:47 PM
Dunno, my take is DC's playing the Steelers definitely plan for Ward. I hear what you're saying about the deep threat guys, still, I think Ward is at the top of their list or they're fools not to cuz he'll kill ya where it hurts, in the middle.

a pennies worth

chisteeler
08-15-2010, 02:07 AM
Some of you refuse to look at reality. Here's some reality...Chris Carter for my money is the 2nd best receiver of all-time. His stats speak volumns and the way he played the game did as well. But in the eyes of the Hall of Fame voters he only has numbers. He was a train wreak off the field early on in his career, and never won anything. This is why he isn't already in the Hall of Fame. Eventually he will be in, but not the 1st or even 2nd ballot because he simply lacks anything (other than stats) to put him there.

Hines Ward on the other hand has a multitude of non-statistical reasons to be in the Hall of Fame. For anyone who thinks he didn't change the WR position, you are dead wrong and need to do some research and get your facts straight.

Some of you even mention Marvin Harrison as a Hall of Famer...not a chance in hell. Not with his recent troubles. He had us all fooled for years into thinking he was a good guy. Check the record, he's a thug.

As for T.O., he's a clown. No way the Hall of Fame voters make it easy on him. The Hall of Fame is a place for those who made important contributions to professional football, not those who highlighted all the negatives of pro athletes like T.O. has.

For those of you who were still playing with toys when Hines was in his prime, here's some facts...

2001-2004

381 receptions (95.25/year) for 4,499 yards (1,124.75/year) and 30 TD's (7.5/year)


2005-2006 (Missed 3 games)

143 receptions (71.5/year) for 1,950 yards (975/year) and 17 TD's (8.5/ year)


2007-2009 (Missed 3 games)

247 receptions (82.3/year) for 2,942 yards (980/year) and 20 TD's (6.67/year)



-4 Pro Bowls (consecutive)

-All NFL team 2002 and 2003

-6 1,000 yard seasons

-Super Bowl XL MVP

-2 Super Bowl rings...and counting

-The first player of Korean descent to play in the Super Bowl

-A pioneer as a QB/ATH Draft prospect

-Steelers All-Time leading receiver in every category

-Has a rule named after him

So because Lawrence Taylor has a ring and some stats, he is worthy of the sacred ground in Canton? This man has been a "train wreck" his whole career...playing days and retired days. So to make the argument about Carter not getting in because of "off field" problems is bogus. LT as is OJ are turds..great players, but turds, so where does the HOF's credibility lie as to getting inducted, or for that matter ejected? Too political, just as everything else...BOO HISS!

darnik44
08-15-2010, 07:11 AM
Maybe DC's don't worry about Hines Ward, that would explain his 112 receptions for 1,329 yards in 2002. It would also explain why he has averaged 81 receptions per season since becoming a starter in 1999.

Stairwayto7
08-15-2010, 09:19 AM
I was actually thinking G.Anderson also. I hate that kickers dont have more of a football role, but if any kicker deserves it, why not him!

SteelerDan43
08-15-2010, 03:41 PM
as for myron cope, he means something to us but he is far from a household name and where would it stop if cope got in ? he is lightyears away from even being in the conversation for HOF ..

He was the Pete Rozelle award winner in 2005 and as such should already be represented in the broadcaster's wing. A well deserved award and honor...

airbrake 1
08-15-2010, 05:42 PM
i think gary anderson will have to wait until adam vinaterie gets in, when this happens i think it will break the ice for some of the kickers,punters and special teams guys,gary anderson,morton anderson, steve tasker to name a few

steelcitysfinestXL
08-16-2010, 05:29 PM
Maybe DC's don't worry about Hines Ward, that would explain his 112 receptions for 1,329 yards in 2002. It would also explain why he has averaged 81 receptions per season since becoming a starter in 1999.

Probley... but there are alot of guys playing now, that put up those numbers EVERY YEAR! TO/Moss/Harrison AVERAGED those numbers. Brandon Marshall has done that for 3 striaght seasons. Andre Johnson has 3 seasons like that. Fitz LAUGHS at those numbers. Come up with something better than ONE ABOVE AVG YEAR... Wes Welker is somewhere in NE laughing at that post right now!

harpo
08-18-2010, 08:18 AM
I think that they need to change the people who vote for players to be inducted into the Hall and I also think they need to change the selection process. I think that the people who vote should be players and coaches (perhaps 75% players/25% coaches, or 60/40, 50/50, etc.). I am against people voting who've never played the game on ANY level and never coached on ANY level (especially the professional level).

The way the process is setup now is ridiculous: a bunch of jealous, non-athletic sportswriters, who probably hold grudges because some jock in high school got the girl he only dreamed of having. Many of which, who've probably never even played pee-wee football, gets to decide how great a player is/was when they've never played with or against that particular player. Many of them are bias to players who play in their city, which is understandable. And many of them hold grudges to certain players just because the player didn't grant them an interview and/or perhaps said something they didn't like during an interview. Or, maybe because of some off-the-field issue(s) involving a player.

Now, i'm sure that players and coaches will also have biasness towards certain players but I think the players/coaches voting panel would be more genuine than the way it's done now because of the fraternal aspect of the NFL. Players may not like certain players but they KNOW how great that player was. My opinion is that only a player's peers/opponents or coaches/opposing coaches really know what it is like to go head-to-head with that player everyday in practice or on every Sunday.

Now, with having had my early morning rant about the flawed HOF induction process :-), my thoughts on the next former/current Steeler to make the HOF.....


1. Dermonti Dawson (should already be in)

I couldn't agree more...

2. Jerome Bettis (2nd ballot)

He could be 2nd ballot but it depends on who's coming up with him.

3. Gary Anderson (NFL All-Time leading scorer)

I guess it's possible but I wouldn't hold my breath.... :-)

4. Myron Cope

Steelers HOF, of course.....NFL HOF???? :-)

5. L.C. Greenwood (eventually the veterans commitee will get him in)

I'm not sure about this one. If he does, he may not live to experience it, unfortunately.

6. Kevin Greene (within the next 4-5 years)

I think that he'll get in eventually. But would he go in as a 'Ram' (8 seasons) or 'Steeler' (3 seasons)?

7. Alan Faneca (should be a 1st ballot HOFer)

I don't know about 1st ballot but he might make it in...

8. Hines Ward (might take 10 years after retirment, but he'll get in (2023?)

I definitely agree. It might take an 'Art Monk' type of laboring for him, but he'll definitely get in....

9. Bill Cowher (could be awhile if he get's back into coaching)

As of right now, I can't see it. But if he comes back and wins another SB, he stands a chance....

10. Troy Polamalu (provided he can get healthy and stay healthy)

He'll get in...

11. Ben Roethlisberger (barring no more off the field issues, and continued success, 1 more SB win makes him a lock)

He'll get in....