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View Full Version : So was it a TD? Absolutely if you watched it; NFL confirms ruling!



BlitzburghRockCity
12-14-2008, 08:02 PM
If you watched Holmes he clearly had both feet in the endzone and control of the ball when he caught it but the main key was that as soon as he caught he kept it close and was able to have the nose of the football cross the plain. Just barely but it was in fact a TD.

The Ravens will cry foul and whine like they always do but that's who they are. A bunch of talkers who whine about everything.

drucifer
12-14-2008, 08:08 PM
Agreed! I saw it best in the slo-mo shot that Nantz and Simms were reviewing, and saw it exactly how you describe it.

Bombhunter
12-14-2008, 08:08 PM
While it was a TD, I just wish it was a good, ***-kicking victory, instead of having to put it in the ref's hands to decide. No excuses from Baltimore, other than that they stink...

BlitzburghRockCity
12-14-2008, 08:09 PM
It was a close as you can get no doubt and my heart stopped I think literally till I watched it in slow motion like you did and the officials got it right thank goodness after the review. You can bet they'll be talking about this one on NFLN and everywhere else all week.

Koopa
12-14-2008, 08:10 PM
if ben had more arm strength holmes wouldn't have had to fall forward, but it was clearly a td......... so who gives a **** if the ravens cry, not like they can change it, all the refs will do is says oops my bad, but it will still be chalked up as a loss for them

jpele
12-14-2008, 08:10 PM
If you watched Holmes he clearly had both feet in the endzone and control of the ball when he caught it but the main key was that as soon as he caught he kept it close and was able to have the nose of the football cross the plain. Just barely but it was in fact a TD.

The Ravens will cry foul and whine like they always do but that's who they are. A bunch of talkers who whine about everything.

It was a TD, but think of it this way. The Ravens with their great defense had 3+ minutes and 90 yards to stop us. Great job Steelers.

Black@Gold Forever32
12-14-2008, 08:11 PM
I don't know for sure since it was so close....But it doesn't matter buddy at this point....We're the Champs of the AFC North again and I'll take it......Hey Ratbirds can't cry foul when Holmes gave them a gift close to their end zone....The Steelers defense stepped up again and held them to a field goal.......They had their chances and they blew it.....Plus Big Ben and Holmes both deserve huge credit for extending that play......Tomlin would have went for the win anyway...I'm sure of it....

XLJohn
12-14-2008, 08:19 PM
That was one heckuva game I really beleive this is a point in our year that we all look back on and say that this was the game that put us in the SUPER BOWL, We have to give it up to the D for the pateince they showed to come back and give us the win

ejsteeler
12-14-2008, 08:21 PM
I agree, it was a TD. They are already spouting how contraversial it was on Football Night in America. But hey, we have to remember, even though the O has been flat lately, we played a mirror image of our D and won! That's counts for something. :yesnod:

steelers4life66
12-14-2008, 08:24 PM
HELL YA IT WAS!!!:cope::shots:

DBR96A
12-14-2008, 08:28 PM
I hope we win out and Dallas beats Baltimore.

steelers4life66
12-14-2008, 08:34 PM
I hope we win out and Dallas beats Baltimore.
I have no doubt we can beat Titans. Texans were in their face all night. If they can do it I know we can. :cope:

LarryNJ
12-14-2008, 08:34 PM
.....Plus Big Ben and Holmes both deserve huge credit for extending that play......Tomlin would have went for the win anyway...I'm sure of it....

Ben ran around for about 10 seconds...it was great...classic Big Ben!

Ambridge
12-14-2008, 09:04 PM
Great game!!
Nothing like curseing at the Steelers (Ben, Tomlin, Arians...etc) for almost an entire game and getting mad as hell.....just to have it end with a win and snatching a victory out of the jaws of defeat.
:tt02::tt02:

steelers4life66
12-14-2008, 09:11 PM
Great game!!
Nothing like curseing at the Steelers (Ben, Tomlin, Arians...etc) for almost an entire game and getting mad as hell.....just to have it end with a win and snatching a victory out of the jaws of defeat.
:tt02::tt02:
The main thing I was pissed about was they wouldn't put moore in the damn game. put him in first quarter two or three run he had over ten yards,

HUNT4SEVEN
12-14-2008, 09:31 PM
NO doubt in my mind:tt02:, he had two feet in an control an he tucked the ball when he caught it:yellowthumb:, an way to go Defense:yellowthumb: we keept the Rats out of the end zone:clap::clap: that's like an shut out to me :lol: but our offense SUCKS, if we win the super bowl i still say Fire Air head Arians:lol:

scott0326
12-14-2008, 09:33 PM
IMO It was clearly a TD, he had the ball over the goaline, barely but he did! AFC NORTH CHAMPS!!!!!!:tt02::tt02::tt02::tt02::tt02:

SteelCityMan786
12-14-2008, 10:06 PM
Folks,

I just watched the highlights on NBC's Sunday Night Football. They used a magnification clip on the picture delivered through the Aerial Camera. It showed that the ball DID IN FACT BUST THE PLAIN which makes it a Touchdown.

Moondog
12-14-2008, 11:11 PM
Raven fans are hating and saying that the Steelers AFC North championship is tainted. Maybe I'm biased but it looked like a TD to me.

Stairwayto7
12-14-2008, 11:31 PM
It makes you wonder what Tomlin would have done if they caled the play wrong?

mcfly06
12-14-2008, 11:37 PM
It was clearly a TD,who cares what ravens fans say or think about it.they lost we were the better team!their just worried because they have a chance at not makein the playoffs.LOL and i love IT!!!GO STEELERS!!!!

champnation
12-14-2008, 11:51 PM
It was very close but either way we beat the ravens and continue on. This season is starting to remind me of another season a few years back in which if I recall it finished pretty well.

RW318
12-15-2008, 12:00 AM
There's no way you overturn that call....not saying you don't get it right after with a QB sneak but the official was bat **** crazy for doing what he did. The evidence was FAR from "conclusive"....and that is the only way you can get a call overturned. Guess the refs don't hate you as much as you say lol.

AZ_Steeler
12-15-2008, 12:09 AM
I'm sure this one will be debated for a long time to come... it would be interesting though if they had ruled it a TD to begin with and then reviewed it ;)

blackngold29
12-15-2008, 12:30 AM
I think a lot of people missed the point. In the front of the endzone feet mean nothing, all that matters is the ball. If he's standing in the endzone, but the ball doesn't break the goal line then it's not a touchdown. I felt that the ball did break the line and obviously the refs agree, but feet have nothing to do with it.

Koopa
12-15-2008, 12:31 AM
There's no way you overturn that call....not saying you don't get it right after with a QB sneak but the official was bat shiat crazy for doing what he did. The evidence was FAR from "conclusive"....and that is the only way you can get a call overturned. Guess the refs don't hate you as much as you say lol.

we don't qb sneak, if we don't get it, we have an obvious run with willie up the middle and he loses 3 yards........ thank god for the refs........... and don't act like you wouldn't be saying it was a td if it was witten that was in this situation................

AZ_Steeler
12-15-2008, 12:41 AM
Here's a freeze frame but who is to say when this shot was extarcted:

http://f3.yahoofs.com/ymg/ept_sports_nfl_experts__9/ept_sports_nfl_experts-550140535-1229302478.jpg?ymO7zeADz2LVJy97
<link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Steelers-win-comes-after-a-questionable-touchdow;_ylt=AtGuoruEk_F.okNBDHtdAjNDubYF?urn=nfl ,129009)>

blackngold29
12-15-2008, 12:47 AM
Here's a freeze frame but who is to say when this shot was extarcted:

That article is questionable, the caption claims it is the first frame in which he had clear possession and that it isn't in. OK, what about the second frame? Nowhere to be found.

Whether it was in or not, there were obvious calls missed (holding on Harrison, ridiculous holds on Gay Ray) it all evens out. If you can only score nine points against your biggest rival and think you deserve to win... you gotta be kidding.

JensK
12-15-2008, 05:08 AM
Honestly i don't think it was a TD. There is 3 things you have to concider:
1. Were the feets down - check
2. Did the ball cross the line - check
3. Did he have control over the ball when it crossed - not check.

From the slowmotion it really did not look like the ball was under control untill after it was out of TD range. I know im happy that i was not the judge there, because i would have ruled it a 4th and inches. If the ruling in the field was a TD, then they wouldnt have turned it over though, because it was certainly not CLEAR evidence.

Stairwayto7
12-15-2008, 06:06 AM
It was way to close to not be a TD. You have to give a TD when it is that close. Especially since he had two feet in.

JensK
12-15-2008, 06:15 AM
It was way to close to not be a TD. You have to give a TD when it is that close. Especially since he had two feet in.

The feet dosnt matter in this case. The feet in, is when the ball is going out of the field. The important thing really is if he had control over the ball when it crossed the line or not, which i do not believe he had. I would agree with you, that it couldnt be overruled if the ruling on the field said TD, but i did not see any clear evidence that it was a TD on any of the slow-motions i saw, which its have to be to overrule.

Stairwayto7
12-15-2008, 06:29 AM
The feet dosnt matter in this case. The feet in, is when the ball is going out of the field. The important thing really is if he had control over the ball when it crossed the line or not, which i do not believe he had. I would agree with you, that it couldnt be overruled if the ruling on the field said TD, but i did not see any clear evidence that it was a TD on any of the slow-motions i saw, which its have to be to overrule.

I understand the rule. My point is that if it wee in reverse, and he was going forward in to the end zone, it would be tougher to call. But since he had the two feet, way in the endzone, it was still not totaly clear, but I swear at the point of impact, is when the ball first hit the white stripe. Catch, TD, game over.

NCSteeler
12-15-2008, 09:20 AM
At this point I really don't care whether it was or not. The talking heads will talk bad about us whatever. NFLN was saying it changes the whole playoffs and it is a huge mistake, but at the same time these same refs have been screwing teams all year, just because this was week 15 doesn't change that. Don't you think the Chargers would like to have a few bad calls changed?

If they rule it the other way I say we take the tie . at that point in the game our D was shutting them down and our O was coming a live with 2 nice drives, you have momentum and take your chances. Teams that are desperate and know they shouldn't even be in that situation take the chance on the 4th down run, not us.

Beside it was a TD....



Also they showed a shot of the line judge that ruled it not a TD on the field and he had to look around a Raven player to make the call, that may have gone the other way had he had the down the line vantage point.

ejsteeler
12-15-2008, 12:17 PM
We won. AFC North Champions. I guess that means it was a TD.....:yesnod: :cope:

AZ_Steeler
12-15-2008, 02:07 PM
At this point I really don't care whether it was or not. The talking heads will talk bad about us whatever. NFLN was saying it changes the whole playoffs and it is a huge mistake, but at the same time these same refs have been screwing teams all year, just because this was week 15 doesn't change that. Don't you think the Chargers would like to have a few bad calls changed?

If they rule it the other way I say we take the tie . at that point in the game our D was shutting them down and our O was coming a live with 2 nice drives, you have momentum and take your chances. Teams that are desperate and know they shouldn't even be in that situation take the chance on the 4th down run, not us.

Beside it was a TD....



Also they showed a shot of the line judge that ruled it not a TD on the field and he had to look around a Raven player to make the call, that may have gone the other way had he had the down the line vantage point.

As long as the Steelers win out then the Raven game and the "TD" won't matter anymore and playoff picture will be representative of how it looks now anyways. The Ravens would have moved to the second seed for the time being only because the Steelers haven't played their final AFCN game... the media heads are just stirring the pot looking for something to bitch about.

BlitzburghRockCity
12-15-2008, 02:47 PM
My daughter texted me over her lunch saying how the ratbird fans in her school are whining and bitching that the ball never crossed, they got robbed. Bless her heart she's a chip off the old block and defending her black n gold pride to the masses like always. She tells them over and over but they just keep saying the same thing. I just told her to tell them to watch the replay, grow the hell up, and stop listening to what their daddy's tell them.

All it comes down to is this. The ball crossed, just barely by a whisker but it crossed and that's all that matters. We drove 93 yards against their defense at full strength in their own house and took the AFCN title away. They weren't up to the challenge, they couldn't stop us when the game was on the line and we did what we had to do.

Steel Trap86
12-15-2008, 03:08 PM
All it comes down to is this. The ball crossed, just barely by a whisker but it crossed and that's all that matters. We drove 93 yards against their defense at full strength in their own house and took the AFCN title away. They weren't up to the challenge, they couldn't stop us when the game was on the line and we did what we had to do.

A 92 yard drive shows they meant buisness, they were going for the win, not a tie. Ravens couldnt stop us, Hines Ward ran all over that defense and on the TD the angle they showed from above you can see it crosses the line and holmes brings it out of the endzone himself cause his momentum is just going the other way. The Steelers have had the sh!t end of the stick on close calls like that all season, so Iam glad the refs finally got one right

lloydfan4life
12-15-2008, 03:26 PM
Ball crossed, we won, stop crying Baltimore!!!
You'll never be as good as Pittsburgh so just deal with it. :lol:

Even if they get the forensic team out and determine it wasn't a TD, that makes up for all the non-holding calls against Harrison this season!! :yellowthumb:

AZ_Steeler
12-15-2008, 04:38 PM
NFL backs ruling on Steelers' winning (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08350/935329-66.stm?cmpid=steelers.xml)

K Train
12-15-2008, 05:28 PM
it didnt cross, lets please take the glasses off lol.

the game wasnt officiated well to begin with though, and ive NEVER complained about harrison being held, but damnit he was molested in that game and it was never called lol

BlitzburghRockCity
12-15-2008, 06:13 PM
He is molested as you call it..LOL..every freekin week. That's the only way they can block him 90% of the time. He's so compact and powerful that he can bull rush or go by any LT in the league so they have to hold him. The refs could probably call holding in any game on any given week 25 times if they wanted too so they have to balance it out..I get that, letting the teams play and all that but damn it's so freekin blatant with Harrison especially that it just makes me sick. And the dude still has 15 sacks and all his other stats.

Zachintosh66
12-15-2008, 07:55 PM
The plane of the goal line extends indefinitely, and remains active so long as ANY part of the BALL CARRIER remains in bounds and crosses the goal line.

A receiver is deemed to be in possession of a catch when both feet touch down in bounds while the receiver demonstrates control of the football.
"Should a receiver make a legal catch of the ball with both feet in bounds in the end zone, a touchdown shall be awarded even if no part of the ball was deemed to break the plane of the goal line while in possession of the receiving player.

lloydfan4life
12-15-2008, 08:21 PM
He is molested as you call it..LOL..every freekin week. That's the only way they can block him 90% of the time. He's so compact and powerful that he can bull rush or go by any LT in the league so they have to hold him. The refs could probably call holding in any game on any given week 25 times if they wanted too so they have to balance it out..I get that, letting the teams play and all that but damn it's so freekin blatant with Harrison especially that it just makes me sick. And the dude still has 15 sacks and all his other stats.

:plus1: I agree 100%!!
They can't stop him.
He's a freakin' beast!
He was being mugged in this game and it wasn't called once.

PS... the ball DID cross the goal line. The NFL has confirmed it. You can clearly see it during replay. Anyone who can't needs to take their Steeler hatin' glasses off.

LarryNJ
12-15-2008, 09:12 PM
The plane of the goal line extends indefinitely, and remains active so long as ANY part of the BALL CARRIER remains in bounds and crosses the goal line.

A receiver is deemed to be in possession of a catch when both feet touch down in bounds while the receiver demonstrates control of the football.
"Should a receiver make a legal catch of the ball with both feet in bounds in the end zone, a touchdown shall be awarded even if no part of the ball was deemed to break the plane of the goal line while in possession of the receiving player.

So the ball doesn't have to break the plane?

AR Steeler
12-15-2008, 09:23 PM
there were alot of holding and pass int. calls that weren't made and we grab a guys elbow and get called for holding. we would have scored on the next play .

K Train
12-15-2008, 11:26 PM
the one that the commentators commented one and replayed that should have been flagged i was watching the whole play i got up and screamed at work lol. i understand that he is always held...im over it already....BUT that particular play was so obvious it was an obnoxiously blatant no call

the ball didnt cross the plane at all so everyone stfu about and enjoy the bad call lol

DIESELMAN
12-15-2008, 11:29 PM
Either way its a W for us. We would've either went for it on 4th and inches, got the TD or Tomlin would've gone for a FG, went into OT and won it there.

K Train
12-15-2008, 11:40 PM
i would have flipped out if they didnt go for it on 4th

Black@Gold Forever32
12-16-2008, 12:08 AM
I honestly believe Tomlin would have tried to win it and Ben would have sneaked it in......I didn't think it was a TD at first but the more I see the play leads me to think it was a TD.......So I don't think it was a bad call after all.....Ravens had their chances anyway to win the game......

The Holmes fumble gave them a really short field to score a TD and the Steelers defense held the Ravens offense to a field goal....Then late in the game Timmons sacked and stripped Flacco knocking the Ravens out of field goal range.....So the Ravens blew it and they didn't lose because of a controversial call.......

JB 67
12-16-2008, 12:41 AM
NO doubt in my mind:tt02:, he had two feet in an control an he tucked the ball when he caught it:yellowthumb:, an way to go Defense:yellowthumb: we keept the Rats out of the end zone:clap::clap: that's like an shut out to me :lol: but our offense SUCKS, if we win the super bowl i still say Fire Air head Arians:lol: I agree Arians sucks about time they got Hines involved in the Offense..

K Train
12-16-2008, 01:32 AM
biggest play of the game was starks catching reed in mid air while doing a 180 lateral in the air....reed was easily on his way to the endzone.

can we please stop the bitching about arians for a little....we all know hes not the best but hes not the worst either....at 11-3 i think other teams are worse off than us, the offense has been clutch when they have to be...it hasnt been pretty the last 2 weeks but the defenses havent been cupcakes either

Mike Tomlin
12-16-2008, 01:36 AM
It was a touchdown but was called wrong on the filed originally because the line judge couldn't see at the point when the ball broke the plane. The ball breaks the plane when Holmes first catches it. Even Holmes knew it was evident by how close he caught the ball to his body.That's important because when a receiver catches with his hands the ball is caught away from his body. On the catch Holmes gets the ball as close to his facemask as possible, he knew that he had to break the plane

K Train
12-16-2008, 01:47 AM
the thing is, it didnt break the plane no matter how you try to say it....there is no way they had conclusive evidence to overturn it

Mike Tomlin
12-16-2008, 04:14 AM
well obviously it did break the plane.1. I saw it and 2. they overturned it. So guess what.........................TOUCHDOWN!!!! Feel how you want to feel about it.

TampaSteelGirl
12-16-2008, 04:40 AM
biggest play of the game was starks catching reed in mid air while doing a 180 lateral in the air....reed was easily on his way to the endzone.

can we please stop the bitching about arians for a little....we all know hes not the best but hes not the worst either....at 11-3 i think other teams are worse off than us, the offense has been clutch when they have to be...it hasnt been pretty the last 2 weeks but the defenses havent been cupcakes either

I agree with the post entirely. I have to say that considering the schedule we had which is described as the toughest schedule in the NFL, we are 11-3 that's pretty impressive. Wins may not have been pretty but we are getting it done. What matters is what we do in the playoffs! We are on our way to be the first team with 6 Super Bowl rings!! Lets embrace that! :tt02:

LarryNJ
12-16-2008, 07:11 AM
the ball didnt cross the plane at all so everyone stfu about and enjoy the bad call lol


Rule 11 Scoring
Section 2 Touchdown
Article 1 It is a touchdown (3-38):
(a) when a runner advances from the field of play and the ball touches the opponents’
goal line (plane); or
(b) while inbounds any player catches or recovers a loose ball (3-2-3) on or behind the
opponents’ goal line.

The way I interpert the rule is that if you are running the ball the ball must break the plane as stated in A.

But "While inbounds any play (holmes) catches a loose ball on or behind the opponents goal line. So there is no doubt Holmes was behind the goal line when he made the catch. The ball breaking the plane is irrelevant. Even when the ref explained his ruling he never said anything about the ball breaking the plane. Because it doesn't matter.

The mistake they made was saying it crossed the line afterwards. The other possibility is that there is a clarification of the rule that I didn't read.

steelers4life66
12-16-2008, 10:18 AM
well obviously it did break the plane.1. I saw it and 2. they overturned it. So guess what.........................TOUCHDOWN!!!! Feel how you want to feel about it.
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::c lap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::cla p::clap: That's right!!!!

ejsteeler
12-16-2008, 11:18 AM
I agree with everyone that keeps saying it didn't cross the goal line because it didn't. Good thing it doesn't have to though, it just has to break the plane, just the tiniest little bit and that it did. :yesnod:

steelers4life66
12-16-2008, 11:34 AM
They would of gotten the call right to start with of that fat rat bird wouldn't have standing in the way of the line judge. :lol:

K Train
12-16-2008, 03:16 PM
Rule 11 Scoring
Section 2 Touchdown
Article 1 It is a touchdown (3-38):
(a) when a runner advances from the field of play and the ball touches the opponents’
goal line (plane); or
(b) while inbounds any player catches or recovers a loose ball (3-2-3) on or behind the
opponents’ goal line.

The way I interpert the rule is that if you are running the ball the ball must break the plane as stated in A.

But "While inbounds any play (holmes) catches a loose ball on or behind the opponents goal line. So there is no doubt Holmes was behind the goal line when he made the catch. The ball breaking the plane is irrelevant. Even when the ref explained his ruling he never said anything about the ball breaking the plane. Because it doesn't matter.

The mistake they made was saying it crossed the line afterwards. The other possibility is that there is a clarification of the rule that I didn't read.
well then thats a legit explaination....because it didnt cross the plane lol

steelcityrockers
12-16-2008, 03:37 PM
Regardless of whether or not the ball actually did cross the plane, there was not indisputable evidence to change the call on the field.