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View Full Version : Why can't we generate pressure between the tackles?



Iron City South
12-10-2007, 12:27 AM
Sorry guys, I'm starting to think maybe this team needs to go to a 4-3 defense. I dig Fat Casey as much as the next Steelers fan and he is a rock against the run, but watching Wilfork make a game changing sack, RIGHT UP THE MIDDLE against our **** poor offensive line makes me wonder what we can do to generate pressure up the middle. Teams such as NE and Dallas (even Green Bay) are able to generate pressure with their defensive interior where we can not. Fat Casey is never going to be able to generate that kind of pressure up the middle. That isn't his game.

What in the hell can we do?

Do we need to draft a pass rushing DT ala Tommy Harris? Personally, I think it's just time to change philosophy and some personnel. Farrior and Foote are both getting older and just never seem to get there against good teams in a timely manner.

Those elaborate blitz packages rarely work against good teams anymore. Maybe they're just stale and teams know how to pick them up better than they used to.

BlitzburghRockCity
12-10-2007, 12:39 AM
Well really when it comes right down to it, how often does our DL have big games and double digit sacks when it's all said and done...sure I want the front 3 to get that push up the middle and blow up the play as much as anyone and it would greatly benefit us if they do but their main role is to occupy as many blockers as they can to free up the LB's and blitzing DB's to make the plays. IMO the zone blitz works and works well but it all starts with the pass rush and that's up to the LB's as much as the front 3 to get pressure. This team isn't switching to the 4-3 anytime soon based on what Lebeau and Tomlin have said during the course of the year and even as late as the pregame today. Our system works and it's proven, we just need to execute better.

The LB's have to get off blocks as much as the DL needs to hold them.

:2cents:

BlacknGold Bleeder
12-10-2007, 12:50 AM
I didn't see wilfork in the backfield making all that many plays. Yes he did blow up that one play, but other then that his name wasn't called all that much.It's hard to get sacks when the QB is delivering on those short routes where he only has the ball for 3-4 seconds

DIESELMAN
12-10-2007, 12:51 AM
Maybe if we had someone at C besides Mahan this probably would never be brought up. That was my 1 concern goin into this game, how would Mahan do against a DT such as Wilfork? Well he answered that question, granted he only gave up that 1 sack but that was 1 sack we didn't need.

K Train
12-10-2007, 12:53 AM
i saw mahan successfully block someone for the first time today....and then that happened....interior lineman dont get great pressure...tommie harris is jsut a ****ing animal

Iron City South
12-10-2007, 12:58 AM
Today Fanaca earned the nickname "Matador" ... all that was missing was a red cape.

.... he was supposed to be helping Mahan on that Wilfork sack .... instead, he watched Vince walk by.

BlacknGold Bleeder
12-10-2007, 01:19 AM
So who is the center coming out in the draft that the STEELERS are eyeing?? mayham at center ain't working out , maybe when Faneca leaves he will be able to fill his spot...:2cents:

BlitzburghRockCity
12-10-2007, 01:52 AM
Arron Smith is the unsung hero of our defense, he is worth every penny we pay him IMO. Keisel is getting better and better and is starting to come into his own. Casey needs no introduction, Overall 34 defensive lineman never generate big stats but their work is as necessary as anyone else. When our 3 DL are occupying 4 blockers at a time that lets someone run free in the form of a LB or blitzing DB. The problem is that when our LB's can't get off the blocks it makes for a long day.

Blitzburghpete
12-10-2007, 07:26 AM
OK, correct me if i'm wrong here, the reason we lost v the Pats wasn't anything to do with the offence, it was defence. We can't expect the o the score every drive, but by heck they did well last night.

My problem was the dee and it's scheming.

Surely if you play a scheme where you are gonna blitz 4 -5 guys a lot, to make the opposing QB throw quick, then you need to play press man coverage or short zone's 1 - 2 deep safties?

Brady was getting heat, and many times was throwing quick, but the WR's in the 5-8 yard routs were always open because our DB's were never in their face and always given soft coverage underneath, 10 yards back from the line of scrimage. Heck the Pats slot receviers, especially Welker in the 2nd half was given 15 yards. I was screaming at the tv before the snap that a welker 7 and out and he was in the end zone un touched.

The DB's needed to be in the pats receviers face, jam them at the line to disrupt the timing passes, quick heat from the DL and LB's and the safties, play deep to tackle anything or anyone that does break.

It's not rocket science so why didn't anyone do this?

Dick Lebeau, you got it wrong mate.

My terrible towl is flying at half mast today...................

Not a happy bunny

Iron City South
12-10-2007, 08:05 AM
OK, correct me if i'm wrong here, the reason we lost v the Pats wasn't anything to do with the offence, it was defence. We can't expect the o the score every drive, but by heck they did well last night.

My problem was the dee and it's scheming.




OK, I'll correct you .... the offense was just as much to blame and all you need to do is look at 2 things to see it:

1) Red Zone effectiveness and
2) 3rd down conversion success rate


I do agree that our "bend but don't break" defensive scheme is the WRONG one to take vs. a team like the Pats who will "dink and dunk" you to death. The Pats ran the ball a total of 9 times .... 9 times!

The way to play the Pat WR's is to be physical with them, punch them in the mouth right off the line knocking them off their routes.

IMO ... Lebeau's scheme was made a fool of yesterday. :yesnod:

Ambridge
12-10-2007, 08:58 AM
I don't think the nose tackle in the 3-4 is expected to put pressure on the QB. I believe their job is to eat up blockers so the LB's can penetrate gaps on the blitz or run free to make tackles.

"Fat" Casey is right on the money
I believe his listed weight is 325lbs?? but it looks like Casey has ballooned up to 375lbs or possibly more.

Steelersfan
12-10-2007, 09:00 AM
I agree that both the D and O were to blame. I don't think anyone expected us to hold the Pats to under 13 pts. I thought we'd give up maybe 24 or so but would be able to move the ball (which we did) and score 30+ to win. We had the Pats were we needed them at halftime (even though it could have been better!) but forgot to play the second half.

Steelersfan
12-10-2007, 09:03 AM
As it's been said before, if you're gonna blitz LB's we need our DB's to tighten up. If not a QB like Brady will picks us apart like he always does with the short passes. I think our D got scared of getting burnt after the first half and backed off. Sad part is they got burnt biting on play action and not from the Pats just blowing by them.

Ambridge
12-10-2007, 09:57 AM
Sad part is they got burnt biting on play action and not from the Pats just blowing by them.


Biting on play action when the Pats only ran the ball 9 times for 22yds. :dunno:

BlitzburghRockCity
12-10-2007, 10:02 AM
Biting on play action when the Pats only ran the ball 9 times for 22yds. :dunno:

That's what blows my mind, it's not like the pats had any success running the ball when they did try too so we shouldn't have been afraid of that.

Something else that has me concerned..



James Farrior -
"It was a little weird," linebacker James Farrior said. "I thought they'd try to run a little bit when they got a good lead on us, but they kept trying to throw the ball.

What do you mean you thought they'd try to run the ball, they haven't run all year long when they've had the lead, why would they start now !!

Iron City South
12-10-2007, 10:32 AM
Arron Smith is the unsung hero of our defense, he is worth every penny we pay him IMO. Keisel is getting better and better and is starting to come into his own. Casey needs no introduction.

Fat Casey also doesn't need anyone to put anymore chicken & biscuits slathered in gravy in front of him either. I like Fat Casey as a "clogger" in the 3-4, but as I said .... I think our 3-4 has seen it's better days. Fat Casey will never get enough push off the line to be considered a force in pressuring the QB ... that's not his game.

I agree on Smith and also see him doing very well in a 4-3 role, in fact, he may even be better. Kiesel on the other hand isn't enough of an athlete for what they're asking him to do. He generally takes on the OT as the "rover" and is undersized, underskilled, and cannot match the strength of an OT. Don't get me wrong, Kiesel is a good football player. Plays hard, good motor ... he's just not going to excel in this league to any elite status in the role he is currently in.

Blitzburghpete
12-10-2007, 10:44 AM
I do agree that our "bend but don't break" defensive scheme is the WRONG one to take vs. a team like the Pats who will "dink and dunk" you to death. The Pats ran the ball a total of 9 times .... 9 times!

The way to play the Pat WR's is to be physical with them, punch them in the mouth right off the line knocking them off their routes.

IMO ... Lebeau's scheme was made a fool of yesterday. :yesnod:

LOL ICS, do i detect that i agree on you with something???? LOL
I'm teasing!!

No every offence no matter how good scores every time i mean heck even tha pats had to settle for some fg's against us. Didn't i hear correct that the Pats kicker got more fg's this game than any other? ( 3 )
So yeah we should have / could have punched the ball in more, but i thought our o played really well despite the lack of TD's

The thing we mainly agree on though is Lebeau's scheme. I don't know about you but i thought we were in "prevent" defence mode all night long. And then to add insult to injury, when we did blitz it was always the same bunch of guys, ie, DL or LB's.
I can only recall 1 CB - Saftey Blitz, and the CB Taylor batted the pass down.

Again this isn't rocket science so WFT was Lebeau thinking?

BlitzburghRockCity
12-10-2007, 10:59 AM
The scheme the Steelers employed was on that they normally have success with, in that we made them one dimensional and that usually translates into a win. However in this case the Pats didn't try to run much because they normally don't try that, they can be more effective in throwing the ball so that is their weapon of choice. The defense got caught looking for the run all too often and biting on stuff they shouldn't have bitten on and that allowed all those big plays.

Basically we should have been looking for the pass all day long yesterday and we got caught trying to defend something that wasn't going to happen.