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View Full Version : Steelers special teams coach needs fired!



Forged in Steel
11-11-2007, 10:41 PM
The Steelers special teams coach needs to be fired after those to crappy returns by that Browns guy. :willybs:

BRICKTOWN BEAST
11-11-2007, 11:30 PM
AGREED

BlitzburghRockCity
11-11-2007, 11:30 PM
Please don't hold back, tell us how you really feel..LOL.

Honestly though, the coverage units have no excuse for allowing those 2 huge returns today, especially the 100 yd one. Everybody thought Cribbs was out of bounds so they stopped playing and by the time they realized the play was still alive he was half way to the end zone.

I did like how Rossum played today, he had some big returns and is a sure handed returner. There was 1 time when he fair caught the ball that he could have returned but he realized that right away. Overall though he had some nice plays today.

DIESELMAN
11-11-2007, 11:35 PM
No one was covering the sidelines on that kickoff return, our pursuit angles were all screwed up today. Definitely need to do something about our defensive ST play

BlacknGold Bleeder
11-11-2007, 11:38 PM
Special teams are still playing 100 % percent better then last year. Last year every time was an adventure, at least this year we know they catch the ball... now they just have to tackle them...

BlitzburghRockCity
11-11-2007, 11:43 PM
That's a good point BnG, we are worlds better than last year. Our coverage overall is better and our return game is definitely more sound. We still need more production out of the punt return team and obviously the coverage units definitely need to be more aware of finishing the play.

steelerfan11
11-12-2007, 12:50 AM
Anyone else see Harrison back on ST next week? I don't think he played on them today. I know him playing ST is another chance to get injured but he is a beast.

Woodson_DownUnder
11-12-2007, 04:14 AM
Special teams are still playing 100 % percent better then last year. Last year every time was an adventure, at least this year we know they catch the ball... now they just have to tackle them...

Willie Reid didn't do himself any favours. Sure, being injury prone is one thing but muffing returns is UNFORGIVABLE. Heck, once in a while, he'll do the right thing and needs all the confidence & experience that he can get but he really isn't the answer. Glad the coaches changed him and bought in Rossum. :banana:

ARKIESTEEL
11-12-2007, 08:14 AM
You take them two big returns away from the Browns and this game is a blowout. I dont know if he needs fired but Coach Mike needs to "makes this problem go away":cursin:

dkanna
11-12-2007, 08:44 AM
Not usre I would say they need to be fired. Just learn a serious lesson from this game and FIX IT.

BlitzburghRockCity
11-12-2007, 10:08 AM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07316/833184-66.stm?cmpid=HBEHTML


Monday, November 12, 2007

By Gerry Dulac, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
Matt Freed/Post-Gazette

Brett Keisel said maybe it is time he comes out of retirement. James Farrior said he would volunteer to play on the kick-coverage team at the start of each half if necessary. Clark Haggans said he is ready, if needed, to play on the coverage units again, something he did at the start of his career.

Coach Mike Tomlin might have volunteers lining up outside his door this week, offering to help the Steelers' special teams. It might be as many players who appeared to have Cleveland kick returner Joshua Cribbs surrounded and trapped near the goal line yesterday at Heinz Field.

Only, in Tomlin's case, he might not let them get away.

"One thing is for certain: We stink as a kickoff coverage unit," Tomlin said.

Stink, though, does not begin to accurately describe the performance of the kick-coverage unit against the Browns, who found another way to lose their ninth consecutive game to the Steelers in a 31-28 defeat.

It was bad enough Cribbs had a 90-yard kickoff return in the first quarter that set up the Browns' second touchdown and gave them a 14-3 lead.

But, after the Steelers rallied from a 21-6 deficit to take a 24-21 lead in the fourth quarter, Cribbs did it again, returning a kickoff 100 yards for a touchdown and seemingly draining the energy from the Steelers.

"We weren't helping at all," said linebacker Andre Frazier, the last player to touch Cribbs near the 16. "We were helping the Browns."

It was the way Cribbs scored that only exacerbated the problem and angered many of the Steelers players on the sideline, including nose tackle Casey Hampton.

Cribbs tried to field a squib kick at the 10, but he muffed the ball and had to run back to the goal line, near the pylon, to retrieve it. Four players, including Allen Rossum and cornerback Anthony Madison, closed in on Cribbs inside the 5, near the sideline.

"When he picks the ball up near the goal line, you got to kill him," said Keisel, a former special-teams terror.

Instead, the Steelers killed themselves, or so it appeared.

Cribbs somehow escaped along the sideline, shook off a tackle by Frazier at the 16, and ran untouched the remainder of the way for a touchdown.

"It was like when we played the Colts in that [2005] playoff game," said Haggans, referring to Jerome Bettis' fumble at the goal line that was nearly returned for a touchdown by Indianapolis cornerback Nick Harper. "A lot of wind goes out of your sails. You're like, 'Yeah, yeah,' one second, then, 'Oh, no; oh no.' "

But, like the playoff victory in Indianapolis, the Steelers survived this mighty scare as well, right down to a missed field-goal attempt in the waning seconds.

"When we played together, we called him little Vick," said linebacker James Harrison, a reference to former Atlanta Falcons quarterback Michael Vick. Harrison and Cribbs, a converted quarterback, were teammates at Kent State. "He's fast, he's quick and he has great vision."

Great vision is not needed to see the problems with the Steelers' kick-coverage unit.

It was so bad Harrison, a special-teams co-captain, volunteered to play on the kick-coverage team after the Steelers took the lead with 3:13 remaining. Sure enough, Harrison, who has played sparingly on the coverage units the past two weeks, tripped up Cribbs and held him to six yards on the final return.

"We have to be honest with ourselves -- we need some work," Rossum said.

Work?

It might not be possible for a National Football League team to spend more time working on special teams than the Steelers, who employ two full-time assistant coaches to handle special teams. It began in training camp, when morning practices were devoted solely to special teams and assistant coach Bob Ligashesky used volleyballs, Hula Hoops and even footballs on a stick to work with the players. And it has continued through the regular season, even though there is not as much practice time to devote.

"Just imagine what it would look like had we not done that?" Tomlin said.

There were other problems as well. The Steelers had only 10 players on the field when the Browns quickly punted late in the fourth quarter, forcing Harrison to run on the field at the last minute. That caused Rossum, who said he was counting players, to refuse a fair catch and let the ball roll to the Steelers' 11.

But that is minor compared to the troubles the Steelers have had with their kick coverage.

In the past three games, the Steelers have allowed seven kick returns of 33 yards or longer -- four of 42 yards or longer. For the season, they have allowed six returns of 42 yards or longer, including four of 52 yards or longer.

"Maybe I got to come out of retirement," Keisel said.

Either that, or get out the Hula Hoops.

Stink doesn't even begin to cover it. There is no excuse for allowing 2 90+ yd returns in 1 game especially under those circumstances.

Jeff Reed's kickoff's are too short and the coverage unit's are not staying in their lanes and getting of blocks. We'd be better off just kicking out of bounds at this rate :cursin:

What ever happened to kicking off to the corner and pinning the returner in and gang tackling him !! Hell whatever happened to just tackling the guy at all !

DIESELMAN
11-12-2007, 10:14 AM
In the beginning of the year Reed was drilling the ball into the endzone for touchbacks, WTF is happening to him? I'd rather see a whiff on a tackle when our guys are going balls to the walls then coming down at half speed and then getting juked and breaking their ankles. I thought for sure we had them on the 1 on the KO, but Rossum who was the first one down their half assed it, he should've been in the air sailing towards him, **** it take a penalty for a early hit, but just drill him, then next time he'll hear footsteps where their ain't none.

BlitzburghRockCity
11-12-2007, 10:25 AM
Yeah that's a good point, earlier we were happy to see Reed driving those kicks into the endzone. I hate to see so many starters lining up to play ST because you risk serious injury doing that with key players but at this point I don't know what other choice Tomlin might have.

GoBenGo
11-12-2007, 11:29 AM
aGREED! Horrid! 2-3 guys in the same lane, getting taaken out by one guy. guys standing around. It was an abomination.WTF?:cursin: iT'S THE ONLY THING THAT KEPT THEM IN THE GAME!

ARKIESTEEL
11-12-2007, 12:36 PM
One thing I got to say about them two big run backs AFN (all for nothing) All they did was get Cribbs tired and our O and D fired up! see you next year browns

steelcitysfinestXL
11-12-2007, 12:49 PM
They dont need to fire anyone the guys on the field have to make the tackle ...period!!!! it isnt like we havent had guys in position its that they are all trying to arm tackle... have harrison hold ST's tackling drill... that MOTHER F----- knows how to form tackle!!!

GoBenGo
11-12-2007, 01:04 PM
In the beginning of the year Reed was drilling the ball into the endzone for touchbacks, WTF is happening to him? I'd rather see a whiff on a tackle when our guys are going balls to the walls then coming down at half speed and then getting juked and breaking their ankles. I thought for sure we had them on the 1 on the KO, but Rossum who was the first one down their half assed it, he should've been in the air sailing towards him, **** it take a penalty for a early hit, but just drill him, then next time he'll hear footsteps where their ain't none.
Dude, that sums up my feelings to a T. I sure does not look like most other kickoff teams. Nothing I can Add that you have not said. :clap:
Great Point!
If Ben keeps us scoring, we will be kicking off a good bit, so they better address it.
And anyone else think it's strange our headhunter is also our returner?

Stlrs4Life
11-12-2007, 10:31 PM
Well, can't blame the coach on the 100 yarder, we had like 3 steelers around him when he scooped the ball up at the goal line, every one of them failed to get him. No excuse.

K Train
11-12-2007, 11:45 PM
as much as the coverage sucks, reed is no help at all with the low short kicks

BlacknGold Bleeder
11-12-2007, 11:57 PM
We are 9 games into the season and he don't seem to be able to hit the endzone. I guess we'll be doing onsides kickoffs by the end of the year !! If it's by design that he's kicking short they need to stop that shiat and let him kick away !!

K Train
11-12-2007, 11:59 PM
he kicks short because he cant kick long....plain and simple

BlitzburghRockCity
11-13-2007, 12:14 AM
We might want to look in having a specialist just for kickoffs. Some teams do that and if it helps our guys it may be worth the roster spot to activate on certain weeks?

K Train
11-13-2007, 12:32 AM
theres a guy that wears #9 on our team that has a huge leg...just a thought lol

black an gold 4 life
11-13-2007, 12:58 AM
YEA IF IT WASN'T 4 SPECIAL TEAMS THE CLOWNS WOULD NOT OF BEEN N THE GAME, OUR SPEICAL TEAMS SUCK PLAIN AN SIMPLE WE LET THAT CAT GET 204 YRDS ON RETURNS AN KICKOFFS WTF:cursin:THE N.F.L STANDS 4 NOT 4 LONG IF U KEEP F****** UP LIKE THAT STEELERS SPECIAL TEAMS COACHES AN SPECIAL TEAMS PLAYERS!!!!

SteelersfanWY
11-13-2007, 12:24 PM
They dont need to fire anyone the guys on the field have to make the tackle ...period!!!! it isnt like we havent had guys in position its that they are all trying to arm tackle... have harrison hold ST's tackling drill... that MOTHER F----- knows how to form tackle!!!

Hear Hear,
The coach isn't the one on the field. He is only as good as his players. Once on the field its the the players that are in the middle of it. It is their responsibility to make the tackles. Though they could maybe use a bit more practice at it. It still boils down to the ones wearing the pads.

BBG7
11-13-2007, 01:07 PM
Hear Hear,
The coach isn't the one on the field. He is only as good as his players. Once on the field its the the players that are in the middle of it. It is their responsibility to make the tackles. Though they could maybe use a bit more practice at it. It still boils down to the ones wearing the pads.

Agreed...BUT the players reflect on the coach. I really don't think it's lack of practice, becasue they have emphasized ST more this year and in training camp put those guys to work. All around our STs haven't been playing well. When you look at it as a whole, you have to put some blame on coaching.

BlitzburghRockCity
11-13-2007, 01:14 PM
theres a guy that wears #9 on our team that has a huge leg...just a thought lol


Hey, if he can kick off then more power to him, let's get him out there. I'd rather have us boot every kickoff into the endzone then what we have now.



Hear Hear,
The coach isn't the one on the field. He is only as good as his players. Once on the field its the the players that are in the middle of it. It is their responsibility to make the tackles. Though they could maybe use a bit more practice at it. It still boils down to the ones wearing the pads.

yes it ultimately comes down to the players but still the preparation is obviously not up to par so it's a combination of both. We have had subpar ST for quite awhile now,save for our SB year. These guys need to be more disciplined and if that means spending all day every day at practice on it then so be it but something has to be done because we can't allow that crap that happened on Sunday to happen to us against good teams coming up. I hate to use more starters on the coverage units but at this point I don't know what other choice we have.

SteelersfanWY
11-13-2007, 01:40 PM
Agreed...BUT the players reflect on the coach. I really don't think it's lack of practice, becasue they have emphasized ST more this year and in training camp put those guys to work. All around our STs haven't been playing well. When you look at it as a whole, you have to put some blame on coaching.

Some blame yes, but I don't think it is enough to fire him.

Well, can't blame the coach on the 100 yarder, we had like 3 steelers around him when he scooped the ball up at the goal line, every one of them failed to get him. No excuse.
In a situation like that. It isnít the coach. That is unacceptable.



yes it ultimately comes down to the players but still the preparation is obviously not up to par so it's a combination of both. We have had subpar ST for quite awhile now,save for our SB year. These guys need to be more disciplined and if that means spending all day every day at practice on it then so be it but something has to be done because we can't allow that crap that happened on Sunday to happen to us against good teams coming up. I hate to use more starters on the coverage units but at this point I don't know what other choice we have.

We have to hope that they are seeing the same things we are. Hopefully it will light a fire under there a**. but ultimately they havenít got the right players on the field. That is the coaching problem.

NOVA STEELERS
11-13-2007, 02:25 PM
Need to step it up this week as the jets have IMO the best return specialist in Leon Washington, have to definately keep him in check :2cents:

BlitzburghRockCity
11-13-2007, 08:17 PM
Tomlin mentioned in his press conference today that he doesn't anticipate any roster changes or any major personnel changes on the coverage teams unless injuries dictate it. He said he is open to using more starters if necessary but he's not going to jump on that wagon just yet. He seems to feel that the answers are just technique and minor in nature but because there are so many of them it makes it seem worse than it really is. He said they are approaching their ST that way this week and he'll see what happens.

All I know is we damn well better stay in our lanes and when we get the chance to wrap a guy up we better do so.

K Train
11-13-2007, 08:48 PM
Leon Washington is gonna molest us.....makes me sick, we would be unstoppable with a halfway decent ST....just halfway

BlitzburghRockCity
11-13-2007, 08:58 PM
At this point I'd settle for somewhat adequate, Im not sure halfway is a reachable goal for this team in that area ..LOL

BBG7
11-13-2007, 10:07 PM
At this point I'd settle for somewhat adequate, Im not sure halfway is a reachable goad for this team in that area ..LOL
Sad to say...I'm with you there....lol

BlitzburghRockCity
11-13-2007, 10:13 PM
ST is such a huge part of what you can accomplish on a sunday afternoon, we've just got to figure out a way to get these guys more consistent. One week they don't allow virtually any yards then they face a good returner and it all goes to hell in a handbasket. If we can just atleast kick the damn ball into the endzone we'll be half way there. LOL

BlitzburghRockCity
11-14-2007, 07:13 AM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07318/833669-66.stm


The Philadelphia Eagles once found a good special teams player by opening their stadium doors to all comers in an open tryout. Not only did Vince Papale, a bartender and Eagles season-ticket holder, make the team, he played three seasons for the Eagles and became their special teams captain.

Disney even filmed a 2006 movie about his story, "Invincible."

Any Pittsburgh bartenders out there who think they can cover kickoffs?

Apparently, Steelers coach Mike Tomlin is not willing to follow the Eagles' approach of 30 years ago, even though he does not appear to have many players now who can consistently tackle on kickoffs.

"Just because things go bad, I don't want to have a knee-jerk reaction and be emotional," Tomlin said during his news conference yesterday. "We are not in that business. We are professionals. We have some guys that need to do a little better job at shedding blockers and tackling. We have to do a better job at getting them in position to do that.

"There won't be drastic changes. That is not how we operate."

There likely will be some changes, though, after Cleveland's Joshua Cribbs ran through the Steelers' kickoff team Sunday the way Roger Kingdom once ran over hurdles.

For one, two members of that unit are injured enough so that Tomlin said they are questionable this week -- linebackers LaMarr Woodley and Andre Frazier.

For another, well, when the kickoff coverage team is ranked 27th in the NFL, when you allowed kickoff returns of 90 yards to the 3-yard line and 100 yards to the end zone Sunday, telling the guys to just play better might not be enough.

And yet for another, if the Steelers thought Cribbs was impossible to stop, wait until they get a look Sunday at Leon Washington of the New York Jets. He's the only player in the NFL with three kickoff returns for touchdowns; he leads the league with an average of 33.5 yards per kickoff return; and he hasn't even had the good fortune of returning kicks against the Steelers yet.

"The football gods are always kind to you," Tomlin said sarcastically. "When you are struggling in an area, we get presented with the opportunity to defend the best guy in the world at returning kicks right now, Leon Washington.

"Great! And I mean that. This game and this profession is about challenges and response. I look forward to seeing what we are willing and capable to do in that area this week."

Presumably, that means Tomlin won't cover his eyes on Steelers kickoffs. He would like his team to merely cover better, and more starters might find themselves running under Jeff Reed's kickoffs against the Jets.

"Those are possibilities," Tomlin said. "It is early in the week. We will take a look at all of those. We'll have more information as the week unfolds."

While the kickoff-coverage team has been in the spotlight because of Cribbs and other long returns, the Steelers' special teams as a whole have not performed well this season. The Steelers spent two 2007 draft choices on rookie punter Daniel Sepulveda and a '08 seventh-round pick to acquire return man Allen Rossum in a trade with Atlanta. But overall, special teams play has been poor.

The Steelers rank 23rd in the league in average yards yielded on punt returns, 22nd in gross punting average and 27th in net punting average. They rank 30th in punt-return average and 13th in kickoff-return average, the latter being one area in which they rank among the top half of the league in special teams.

The one bright spot for Steelers special teams play has been kicker Jeff Reed, who has made 14 of his 15 field goal tries, missing only from 65 yards in Denver.

"I'm not happy with much that is going on right now," Tomlin said of his special teams play. "We seek perfection. We have to do a better job in a lot of areas."

So we're not going to go nuts replacing people but at the same time it's going to be interesting to see what personnel might be added to the group this weekend and if they play any better because if they don't then I'm going up to Tomlin's office and demand a tryout :lol:

BlitzburghNation
11-14-2007, 08:01 AM
It's so wierd,,,,,,,,,,Heard in the off-season all summer, about our ST going to be so much improved ~~~ :scratch:

What happened :dunno: The guys have to be more disciplined and stay in there lanes & get nasty & shake off them blocks,,,,,,,,,Also wouldn't hurt if Reed could give us some touch backs !!!!!!!!

NOVA STEELERS
11-14-2007, 08:27 AM
I :dunno: what happened but I recall during pre-season Reed was Kicking the S**t out of the ball.......... Now anytime he reached the goaline I cheer :evilshake:

steelcitysfinestXL
11-14-2007, 10:23 AM
Leon Washington is gonna molest us.....

LOL, yeah its gonna be a big test for the Coverage teams this week cause Leon is a beast... short of Devon Hester this guy is one of the best!!!!

BlitzburghRockCity
11-17-2007, 07:01 AM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07321/834752-66.stm?cmpid=HBEHTML


Isn't that special

In Woodley's absence, linebacker James Harrison continued to work on the slightly reconfigured kickoff team, which also saw cornerback Ike Taylor replace Allen Rossum. This special team got several minutes of overtime work yesterday, including time with coach Mike Tomlin on the field and taking an active role with the unit that yielded 100- and 90-yard returns to Cleveland's Joshua Cribbs last week.